WOOOOO!!!!!
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Nakajin
Canada8763 Posts
WOOOOO!!!!! | ||
WombaT
Northern Ireland20706 Posts
On January 07 2020 21:53 JimmyJRaynor wrote: RTS was at the cutting edge of technology in the mid 90s. Getting to play a low latency 1v1 across the internet was something special in that era. By 2002 low latency 1v1s and 2v2s were common. The buzz of being able to do something that was technically impossible just a few years earlier was gone by 2002. There was a segment of players who wanted even more than 4 people in a video game. In 1995 , a 10 or 12 player low latency game was impossible. By 2002 it was sometimes possible and that segment of people moved on to MOBAs and other types of FPS games. That segment of players now had the possibility of their wishes being granted by 2002. This same "buzz" surrounding cutting edge technology occurred with games like Space Invaders and Punch Out. These games were technically impossible just 2 years before they were released. Starcraft road that same wave of buzz around a previously technically impossible thing ... now being possible. Indeed, especially in Korea with the perfect storm of quite a centralised country, PC bangs etc. Yes it was also a great game which helped but all those factors coalesced together too. I’m old enough to remember playing in ye olden days, UT or Quake with ping that was ‘good’ in the dialup era would be so laggy to modern sensibilities that I’d just leave a game. I’m a monster typer as I assume many who played online games then as VoIP didn’t become widely adopted for maybe as much as a decade from when I first went online in Diablo 1. Downloading a compressed MP3 even took time, and file sharing was a giant pain in the ass. Outside of Korea I’m not even sure BW was as big as people make out. Yes it was a gigantic seller (top 10 PC games of all time iirc), but I mean in terms of years after release. AoE seems to have had a pretty vibrant community forever from what I’ve seen, Quake and a bunch of other games too. I don’t actually know how the numbers all stack up, just SC1 doesn’t seem all that much bigger than some of it’s contemporaries SC2 has done rather well, especially considering the genre it’s in. I’d consider it only a failure vs some of its potential that they screwed up, Bnet 2.0 was a disaster especially early on, and custom maps and mods were totally botched. That really was a shame especially as these weren’t new features, they were features those of us who’d played on Bnet were accustomed to having. That it hasn’t been the cultural phenomenon Brood War was isn’t really a failure IMO, it’s difficult to capture lightning in a bottle once never mind repeat the trick. I don’t think it’s a failure that it’s not as big as LoL etc either. It’s forgotten in the mists of time but SC2 was first out the gate as the eSport of the Twitch era and Riot definitely learned and were emboldened by this themselves. There probably is still a huge League in an alternate timeline where SC2 didn’t come along but it definitely helped. There’s trends SC2 can’t nimbly follow, that the game isn’t really designed around team games in an era where people tend to prefer team games. Skins too. Personally I don’t really like skins and monetisation of that kind, especially in games I don’t play often, but I do see the value in that. Just I don’t play enough of some games to even visually familiarise myself with stock skins. I feel companies are missing a chance to make a buck by charging to force stock skins :p In an RTS you have even less room to manoeuvre, I think they’ve done a decent job thus far between making cool skins that are still really recognisable and cohesive to a certain faction, though I’m not sure how much more they could add. Sorry this turned into rather more of a wall of text than I was originally planning! | ||
yht9657
1810 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland20706 Posts
On January 07 2020 22:30 boxerfred wrote: Well I surely don't know why StarCraft is dead or not dead but I do know that I stopped playing because I wasn't willing to adapt to new units in LotV, basically being a grumpy old man that doesn't like change. We pick up the old friend from time to time and play some 2v2 or 3v3 or even 4v4 madness but it's mainly boring rush-based games that are not as fun as they used to be. Maybe it's just time passing and nostalgia. Still, good times, great memories. We getting old mang, hands don’t move as fast as they used to. I had way more fun in WoL as a ton of friends all played the game, we’re ten years older now so it’s tricky to find both the free time and sync schedules. I think the game state now is generally a good bit better, there’s more stuff to do and more micro potential, the latter I really wanted more of in Wings for us Protoss, but I have a lot less time to explore that. You also had more unique experiences by virtue of things still being figured out and new styles being explored. Squirrel archon toileting Mvp’s fleet was one of the all-time hyped moments, especially given the observer hiding the flank. But when archon toilets became more a facet of standard play and the only direct counter to BL/Infestor they quickly became ridiculous and dumb and were rightly removed. | ||
boxerfred
Germany8360 Posts
On January 08 2020 00:40 Wombat_NI wrote: We getting old mang, hands don’t move as fast as they used to. I had way more fun in WoL as a ton of friends all played the game, we’re ten years older now so it’s tricky to find both the free time and sync schedules. I think the game state now is generally a good bit better, there’s more stuff to do and more micro potential, the latter I really wanted more of in Wings for us Protoss, but I have a lot less time to explore that. You also had more unique experiences by virtue of things still being figured out and new styles being explored. Squirrel archon toileting Mvp’s fleet was one of the all-time hyped moments, especially given the observer hiding the flank. But when archon toilets became more a facet of standard play and the only direct counter to BL/Infestor they quickly became ridiculous and dumb and were rightly removed. I always had some anxiety when it came to 1on1s. I took losses very badly back then and I was always afraid of, well, losing. Playing Protoss in early WoL didn't exactly help, I think with HotS, I switched to Zerg and late in HotS, I pretty much switched between Terran and Zerg. I was Masters back then, I remember getting 3-0'ed by Goody in some Acer cup which I played just for the funsies. These days, those kids just wreck me :D. | ||
JimmyJRaynor
Canada15564 Posts
On January 08 2020 00:33 Wombat_NI wrote: That it hasn’t been the cultural phenomenon Brood War was isn’t really a failure IMO, it’s difficult to capture lightning in a bottle once never mind repeat the trick. that is a great point. I noticed Pacman had huge mainstream cultural impact in 1981. Ms. Pacman comes out in 1982 and there is zero cultural impact. Ms. Pacman is also a much better game than Pacman. What a difference just 1 year made. The consumer , and especially the mainstream consumer, is a very fickle beast. | ||
AmFreak
13 Posts
On January 07 2020 03:04 Nompo wrote: Brood War wasnt popular, the pro gamer were popular. The game crashed into nothing once that scandal happend and that magic was gone. There wasnt an foreigner audience. Or where is that BGH community now Btw: Starcraft has enough fun maps outside of 1v1. Its called Custom Games and Coop. Oh and: Did they mention that Starcraft didnt have payd Cosmetics (back in the days) which are the main selling points for modern games? Broodwar not popular? Lol, this is utter nonsense. | ||
Nompo
4 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8763 Posts
How did you even end up here? | ||
pinky29
54 Posts
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Nompo
4 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8763 Posts
Well Korea, but it's also one of the best selling PC game in history (and it famously didn't sell well in Kr because of the pc cafe). It's hard to have good numbers nowaday since the rise of digital market, but at the start of the previous decade it was in the top5/ top10 of the best selling PC game. So you know, it wasn't exactly a bust... Edit: Sniped by the mods | ||
ojhcv
1 Post
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BlazingGlory
Bulgaria852 Posts
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Dracover
Australia177 Posts
The problem was Blizz (with the support of a lot of players and casters etc at the time) that if you make a great game then everything else will fall into place. Unfortunately that's not the case. Making a great game is step one. Whether it be the marketing, or how to run tournaments etc they are all crucial elements in the final product. I would describe what happened to SC2 as being similar to a guy who made it through the heats at the Olympics. Yes good job, you're much better than most of the runner (games) out there and if your goal is to be good then your pretty good. However SC is like the guy who won the last Olympics, has won the world championships etc to then get last place in the finals of the 100ms. It will be disappointing even though your still much better than 99% of the people (games out there). You will have seen athletes who cry or are pissed getting second, because when you're at the top the goal is to be No1 not 2,3,4,5.....where ever SC2 is now. | ||
JimmyJRaynor
Canada15564 Posts
On January 08 2020 09:36 Dracover wrote: Destiny was right on the money those many years ago and yet we still seem to have people who deny this today. It's all about money. A great game that makes no money is a dead game (or at least an elderly sick one). meh, EA NHL '94 and Tecmo Super Bowl are both 25+ years old and still plugging along. You don't need money to have fun. Toronto, Ontario, Canada is the epicenter of EA NHL '94 competitive play while Madison Wisconsin is the hotbed for Tecmo Super Bowl. https://tecmobowl.org/calendar/event/143-green-bay-wi-012520-tundra-bowl-vii-tsb-national-championship/ | ||
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