The Death of the Hydra? - Page 5
Forum Index > SC2 General |
KevinIX
United States2472 Posts
| ||
dementrio
678 Posts
| ||
ZeromuS
Canada13372 Posts
| ||
Dental Floss
United States1015 Posts
On March 08 2011 10:06 dark fury wrote: Sight, i wonder when people are gonna realize that hydras are deadly if you use them with nydus worm or overlord drops. These options allows you to bypass their biggest weakness; immobility. A well timed hydra/ling drop or nydus attack can be extremly deadly if executed with right timing. Or you could just drop roaches and have a useful unit later. | ||
mnck
Denmark1518 Posts
I still feel the problem is the lack of speed. Hydras just don't fit with a Zerg army. The most important thing about Zerg is still the speed of the army. If you don't have superior speed, how are you ever supposed to set up good flanks? On a personal level I wish hydras and roaches would switch roles. Hydras should be the core unit of the Zerg army, a unit you can mass produce. A unit that can deal with most army compositions reasonably well and not be such a huge risk building. Right now hydras get massively hard countered by anything that gets plus against light and then spash like colossus and storm. In ZvZ hydras are dangerous to build because of banelings. Only once you get enough roaches nothing can actually hit the hydras, you start mixing it in. But the speed is still a problem, and infestor roach is a more mobile and efficient army. In ZvT hydras see almost no use because it gets ownd by the most normal composition terran have. Siege tank marine. And against mech they get completely roasted against blue flame hellions. In ZvP they do very well against stargate play obviously, and can be used for some many timing attacks. But all of these timing attacks rely solely on hitting just before colossus, because there is no unit better against hydras than a colossus, and that's a problem when the main focus of a P army is colossus. I'm starting to favour mass roach corruptor even more in my play against P aswell. Hydras cost a massive amounts of gas you can't afford to when playing against P, you need that gas for upgrades and for corruptors. Hydras are simply not worth the amount of gas it costs. It breaks my heart, as a Zerg player, that the hydra,the most iconic unit of the swarm, is so god damn useless. | ||
Angra
United States2652 Posts
On March 08 2011 10:07 dementrio wrote: Idra said somewhere that he thinks the hydra needs to be redesigned, and the way he suggested to do it is nerfing it /making it cheaper and bring it back to T1, while buffing the roach which would become t2. that seemed an interesting idea to me, because it would also fix the problem with the roach (which is a bad unit lategame, but zerg has to mass it because there's no better option). I've been thinking this would be an interesting idea for a really long time now. I had no idea that Idra had the same idea, haha. I think it would solve a lot of problems if the two tech levels of hydra and roach were switched around, obviously changing their statistics accordingly. You would see a lot more hydra based armies with roach support rather than the other way around, and it would fix a lot of general awkwardness of the race. | ||
Whiplash
United States2928 Posts
| ||
RHMVNovus
United States738 Posts
That said, it would probably be OP Anti-Air if that change occurred and were applied to its air attack and as such, its AA attack would likely need to remain unchanged. It would certainly bolster the Zerg's story arc that 'THEY HAVE EVOLVED, BETTER, FASTER, STRONGER. WE CAN REBUILD HIM. WE HAVE THE TECHNOLOGY.' So too can we, for a price for well under $6 Million, at that, rebuild the hydra into a unit that is useful. | ||
Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
| ||
DizzyDrone
Netherlands629 Posts
| ||
Freedom48
2 Posts
The Hydra sucks The Hydra can shoot up, but it is not good AA. If I do 1-1-1 in TvZ, rush for cloaked banshee(or 1 viking to kill ovie) and I saw the Z go hydra in response..I giggle like a school girl, put down bunkers, secure my nat, then go any tech route I want. If I go open with 1 starport Void and see hydras in response, I play defensive on 2 base, tech to Colo and get the dreaded void/colossus ball. Hydras don't scare a toss against Void, mutas do. Likewise with banshee/viking harass. | ||
Hollis
United States505 Posts
| ||
Ab0miNaTioN_BoB
United States102 Posts
| ||
NoXious90
United Kingdom160 Posts
| ||
Sewi
Germany1697 Posts
Hydras can play a role in ZvP for breaking forge expansions like in BW. Roaches are good, yes but hydras are harder to stop if not scouted quick enough. I I dont like hydras the way they are now but I would have no idea how they could be changed to make them a) more useful and b) not OP. I think we should therefor just wait and see what 1.3 will bring us in terms of new strategies. | ||
Hellhammer
Canada144 Posts
| ||
P00RKID
United States424 Posts
It isn't so broken that it needs huge overhaul in a patch. Probably won't until the expansion anyway, if at all. It is just kind of a bland unit overall, no real abilities that make it special, and blizzard likes to make their units fun to play with, so I can see the hydra getting some attention. If I could submit my own unsolicited upgrade for the hydra in HoTS, I would suggest the upgrade cliff climbing claws (name pending ^^ ) so that Zerg has a unit that can jump up and down cliffs. | ||
StrifeCro
United States69 Posts
Roaches are almost certainly better vs gateway units after their specific upgrades, any kind of surface area problems because roaches are 4 range/hydras 6 range is resolved by using burrow movement underneath forcefields. In almost any kind of battle vs collosus, roach/corruptor is better than mixing in roach/hydra/corruptor. Even after you get tier 3 for broodlords, roach/broodlord is much stronger than hydra/broodlord vs gateway/collosus up to the point that even 1:1 roaches are better usually in that combo. The only reason to make hydras is versus voidrays as anti air and versus immortals. Thing is hydras are pretty unusable off of creep and on creep queens are much better as anti air anyways versus void rays. Burrow movement roach armies beat immortal + gateway units similar cost armies anyways and have more more options of split attacks/base trading only reason to add in hydras would be approaching 200 food cap playing defensive vs 2 base all in protoss with immortals. Of course there are some all in 2 base hydra busts or some all in hydra doom drops vs protoss but the unit is definitely just "dying" in sc2. ZvT nobody ever uses hydras. ZvZ nobody should ever use hydras pretty much, roach/infestor is way way stronger than roach/hydra, don't even think roach/hydra beats mass roach as long as you can force fights before 200 food. | ||
dave333
United States915 Posts
In terms of one supply units you have drones and a pair of lings....oh and banelings I guess. EVERY other unit is 2+ I believe. C'mon..that's not zerg. Back in brood war you had hydras and lings as one supply. I played BW the other day against toss, I 3 hatch muta into hydra/lurker and i was like O_O as to how big my army was. Hydras are also too "all in" of a unit unless its ZvZ. With any other zerg unit (except the baneling which kills itself), zerg is usually able to call its shots on when to fight, and when to run. You rarely truly commit to an attack since its so easy to retreat. However, any time you attack with a hydra off creep, you are committing yourself to attacking because there will be no hydra retreat. It's a pretty unzerg thing. Brood lords and ultras are a bit similar, but ultras are supposed to be a sort of linebreaker that you commit an attack to, and brood lords are similar. | ||
Lexpar
1813 Posts
| ||
| ||