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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 15 2013 09:03 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 15 2013 08:59 kitaman27 wrote: A few extra votes will help to ensure the lynch. I'm always paranoid about a majority lynch setup where mafia might have vote altering mechanics. It's actually statistically more likely town has the vote-altering roles, I say.
Ya, but I'm less worried about a townie forcing a nolynch.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Bleh and BH's role was so good too...
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 15 2013 09:09 Crossfire99 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 15 2013 09:08 austinmcc wrote: Wait, I'm sorry. Did we have someone create a power that kills the first voter, and then not see fit to note what was going to happen here? Brilliant point. His role creator has a lot to explain why he didn't stop this. Well I really gtg so bye.
I was thinking the same thing. Wouldn't the role creator bring that up as town if he knew BH was going to get killed too? I think his role creator should claim and if he doesn't claim we assume he is scum.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Bleh looks like I messed up with this one.
I tried to consider what I would have done with the role if I were in kurumi's place. What I would have done would be to choose the scummiest player in the thread. The reason for this is that the role is essentially a compulsive vigilante if you choose to shoot and the other player doesn't shoot, which would be really powerful. I didn't think it made much sense for a town kurumi to choose me. We voted together, following up on my earlier suspicions of sylencia and he never shared any suspicions of me in the thread. If he wasn't trying to kill me, why would you use a vig/information role on a player that you trust?
This is the post in particular that spooked me the most:
On February 15 2013 07:03 Kurumi wrote: I'm keeping my vote on Sylencia - he is thinking I will risk my life to confirm him as "town", never answered why he felt overwhelemed, actively lurked and still refuses to play. Also, he is the creator of my role and tried to convince me into a situation where I could die >_>
I thought kurumi was focusing way too much on not wanting to risk his own life for town. It seems to me that the most logical choice would have been to use the role on Sylencia and either shoot him or force him to alignment claim. I couldn't make sense of why he wouldn't go after his number one scum read with a detective vig role.
In retrospect, I should have just shared/passed to guarantee that we have a town player elected, but it looks like I goofed.
On February 16 2013 09:20 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On February 16 2013 09:18 Dandel Ion wrote:On February 16 2013 09:16 iamperfection wrote:On February 16 2013 09:15 Dandel Ion wrote:On February 16 2013 09:14 iamperfection wrote: Kill kita right ¿ why? Because of the role I have a hard time seeing scum pick the option where you announce yourself as the killer. But maybe that's just me. Unless he thought krumi was going to kill him.....
No offense to kurumi, but a 1:1 trade with him as scum would be pretty pointless. If I were scum, I could have just selected pass, which would be essentially no risk for me, and I would receive kurumi's alignment.
On February 16 2013 12:12 Sylencia wrote: Kill kita, Kurumi's first post clearly states he wasn't going to kill. (I was the one who created Kurumi's role, hence why I wanted him to check me)
On February 13 2013 09:55 Kurumi wrote: I would like to welcome everyone to this great game. I hope we shall have fun together and be able to talk about this game in the future while sipping some good beer. As for obvious obviousnessess, it seems the poison is only for Day 1... Secret ballot is not something I'd root for. We should think if the Poison penalty will haunt this game or not. If it indeed does, my dear colleagues I think we could go for either of the remaining two. Both give us a list which we can analyse - isn't that great? On the topic of lists, I am going to make one just now: Tit for tat Friendship Love 100 1000 10000 I shall not kill, because that is not my job. I hope you, my dear friends will refrain from doing so. I love my tea. Not drinking it would be horrible. Someone up for some tea? I think we'd have great time together, every one of you is such a great company! Also, I dislike loud people. Dandel Ion, could you turn your volume down, pretty please? Merci.
You've got to be crazy if you think that I would be able to pick up a breadcrumb from his first post in the game without knowledge of his role. You created his role so you would be able to notice something that anyone else wouldn't.
Also, I'll be running for election today. I propose that if I'm elected, I will share the options in the thread with everyone and we come to a consensus for the best option. I promise to be 100% transparent if chosen. Now that its the weekend I'll have a lot more time for reading the thread and posting. I'll come up with my lynch preferences tomorrow since that should be the priority over the election. We're in a tough spot, but as long as we stay active we have a chance of turning things around.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 16 2013 12:36 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +If I were scum, I could have just selected pass, which would be essentially no risk for me, and I would receive kurumi's alignment. All my wat. Why the fuck you even arguing that you would want to know his alignment if you were scum? Cuz you'd generally ALREADY KNOW IT. like what the actual fuck
Huh? I'm saying if I were scum, I could have picked pass, and not given up my alignment nor have to worry about the spotlight of a kill. It would be a no risk scenario and receiving kuruimi's alignment would be the result. I'm saying the benefit would be not risk, not kurumi's useless alignment information.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 16 2013 13:57 Sylencia wrote: You were given information about your choices, and the consequences of each one. Given the nature of the game - it's likely that Kurumi would've breadcrumbed something during Day 1 and yet you somehow didn't read the clear line that says "I shall not kill"? That's not even a cryptic clue - it's as clear as day.
Kurumi's first three posts were full of nonsense spam. I never made the connection and that's the truth. Show of hands, besides sylencia, who here picked up on that?
Going back to yesterday before the lynch you posted the following:
On February 15 2013 08:39 Sylencia wrote: Kita: I am going to change my vote, there's no point keeping it on you - seeing as how the vote wasn't even a serious one in the first place
The only thing that has changed since then is my decision to choose shoot. It would be one thing if you were trying to argue that the decision in itself to shoot kurumi is scummy, but instead you're arguing that I'm scum by overstating how apparent a breadcrumb was?
You were quick to jump on oats without providing a single reasoning and now you're trying to capitalize on my mistake by trying to make it look like I purposely ignored something that I never noticed to begin with. Yes I made a mistake, but its not with malicious intention. You pay no notice to jcarl mistakenly killing off bh, yet you jump on this. It's clear you've decided to align yourself against me after I've been pushing you day one due to the fact that you've already decided to push for my lynch without bringing up anything from day one and only focusing on a single detail. A town player looks at the big picture, while a mafia player tries to look for easy targets and that's exactly what you have been doing.
I'll have to take a look at the other low profile players tomorrow since I'm really tired.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
So I just went back through everyone's filters. The thing that frustrates me the most is that I've been waiting and waiting for certain players to post and share their opinions, but it just hasn't come. If you would ask me to point out a single thing that someone like Mr. Cheesecake has done, positive or negative, I wouldn't be able to. How are we supposed to come up with a good lynch if nobody is putting in the effort to try. Dandel was right in saying that there isn't a single other player that I would be confident in trusting and calling town. We all share the blame on that, but its even worse if no one tries to improve things.
Not a single person has tried to look back at the day one lynch, so I figured that would be a good place to start. More importantly, I'm looking at players at decided to swap to oats without expressing suspicion of him. Lynching just for the sake of lynching is definitely a mafia trait. At the same time, I'm also looking at the players that stuck on an player that had no chance of getting lynched at the end of the day in a majority format. By not voting for one of the main candidates, they placed a meaningless vote.
Dandel Ion, Sylencia, Crossfire99, kitaman27, gonzaw and jcarlsoniv were on the oats wagon. Marvellosity and iamperfection were on hassy. Mr. Cheesecake was a single vote on Crossfire99 Stutters695 was a single vote on iamperfection Hassy voted for no one.
I'll start with the stragglers:
With the stutters vote, he never provides a reason for iamperfection, besides the fact that he is trying to consolidate. He lists two others players as a preferred lynch, but puts little effort into pushing them. He doesn't really share one way or another what his view is on oats. He was away for most of day one, but I find the way he approached the lynch scummy.
Mr. Cheesecake votes Crossfire99 as a self proclaimed sheep vote and hasn't returned in four days. Don't really have much to say about him alignment wise.
Marv starts the hassy bandwagon, but I'm not seeing the same things that he was seeing. To me, hassy is completely null. Lynching a lurker is fine if there isn't a strong alternative, but like I explained earlier, I think Sylencia would have been a much better scummy lurker lynch. Marv didn't seem very interested in day one, which earns him scum points.
iamperfection doesn't really provide a huge case about hassy, but at least he shows to care about the lynch. There are numerous occasions where he tries to convince others to join his bandwagon. Even though iamperfection was one of the main alternatives to the oats mislynch, I'm leaning town on him based on his interest in day one.
Now onto the oats lynch. As with most majority lynches, things swung real fast. I'll take a look at the votes in order:
Dandel Ion is a player who moved his vote around to several players throughout the day, which earns him town points. Generally a mafia player likes to stick to a single player and cause the least amount of trouble. Dandel tries to generate pressure on several players and is fairly open with his opinions.
Sylencia had his vote on me the entire cycle explaining it wasn't a "serious vote". At the end of the cycle, he moves his vote over to oats explaining that the case on oats is more "compelling" without actually pointing out anything from the case that he agrees with. Notice how he is more focused on finding a player to vote, than finding evidence that a player is scummy. He jumps on the oats wagon without even referencing him at another point and decides to rely on other players to do the scumhunting. Sylencia is still the player that I am most confident will flip scum.
Crossfire99 is another one of the players that jumped on the oats wagon without referencing him earlier in the day, which also earns him scum points. He votes for oats simply to consolidate the lynch, without explaining why he thought oats was a scummy player.
Kitaman27 - That's me.
gonzaw starts off defending oats from BH. After stating that hassy is his preferred lynch, he swaps over to oats at the end. He does appear to look back at one of oat's games to compare his play to this game, which earns him town points, but he wasn't on hassy very long before deciding to swap over to oats, which shows he didn't have much resolve.
jcarlsoniv is really awesome. Though he also might be scum, which would break my heart. In his defense of allowing BH to be lynched through the oats ability, he brings up the fact that he thought BH was starting a panic lynch, which would result in a town mislynch. The part that troubles me though, is that he had no problem joining this panic lynch.
On February 15 2013 08:56 jcarlsoniv wrote: So...oats? Ok
With this post, it seems like he is letting the town decide who to lynch, rather than push the player he thinks is most likely to be scum. The biggest thing to consider with soniv is whether or not as scum he would want to spotlight of killing off BH. Blazinghand had a pretty awesome role, but a 1:1 trade with him wouldn't be worth it.
I'll post more about players actually filters later, rather than just the events surrounding the actual lynch. I have a wedding to go to today so I might not be able to post again until tonight (And this post took far longer than I was hoping -_-)
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 00:21 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2013 00:19 Dandel Ion wrote: I quite like my wisdom. You seem to like it too. Unless of course, it were concerning you.
That you possess the arrogance to even think you may be elected after the play you displayed in this game should make you sad. At least as sad as it makes me. This one also does apply to kitaman btw.
This isn't arrogance, its the fact that I want to do whatever I can to ensure the election ends up in town hands. Sure I made a mistake with kurumi, but compounding that error by giving up and letting the roles end up in scum hands isn't going to help us.
Who else is a better candidate than me? A single player in this game hasn't flipped a scum player yet so we're all on equal footing. At least I'm trying to get things moving.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 03:17 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2013 03:10 kitaman27 wrote:On February 17 2013 00:21 Dandel Ion wrote:On February 17 2013 00:19 Dandel Ion wrote: I quite like my wisdom. You seem to like it too. Unless of course, it were concerning you.
That you possess the arrogance to even think you may be elected after the play you displayed in this game should make you sad. At least as sad as it makes me. This one also does apply to kitaman btw. This isn't arrogance, its the fact that I want to do whatever I can to ensure the election ends up in town hands. Sure I made a mistake with kurumi, but compounding that error by giving up and letting the roles end up in scum hands isn't going to help us. Who else is a better candidate than me? A single player in this game hasn't flipped a scum player yet so we're all on equal footing. At least I'm trying to get things moving. Moving where?
That one post was more than the combined efforts of 3-4 of the remaining players. No comments on anything?
On February 17 2013 03:17 Dandel Ion wrote: I see you tunneling sylencia for days, and not doing much else of anything.
So do you have a town read on sylencia? I'm having trouble coming up with a scenario where he's not scum, unless we were hit with a game where half the scum team is afk.
On February 17 2013 03:19 marvellosity wrote: The gentleman made a 'mistake' by 'accidentally' killing gentleman Kurumi, who wished to eject the same gentleman.
Naturally the same gentleman, who was perhaps a tenth as bothered with the discourse as I, gives me points of evil for not being bothered. Gentleman Austin was right about this one.
hey marv, you don't have a post restriction. Its self imposed....so you're allowed to stop. Maybe you could spend less time coming up with nonsense and more time pressuring players.
On February 17 2013 03:20 Dandel Ion wrote: So, you down for lynching gonzaw?
I'd say he is in my top 6 scum candidates right now, so yes. sylencia is my preferred candidate and I'd like a chance to reread crossfire and jcarlsoniv before I decide. I'm also interested in seeing who gonzaw decides to push today/how much effort he puts in. From my experience, a lazy gonzaw is usually a scum gonzaw.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 03:27 kitaman27 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2013 03:17 Dandel Ion wrote: I see you tunneling sylencia for days, and not doing much else of anything. So do you have a town read on sylencia? I'm having trouble coming up with a scenario where he's not scum, unless we were hit with a game where half the scum team is afk.
While we're at it, does anyone actually have a town read on sylencia? I'm having an awful difficult time pushing his lynch for a player that nobody actually views as pro-town.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 04:21 Stutters695 wrote: It's my Girlfriend's birthday today so I'll be pretty inactive until tomorrow unless work is slow. Kita why is Gonz in your top six? I'm assuming since you said six specifically he's either tied for the bottom of that list or he is sixth. If that's the case why would you be ok with your sixth best choice if syl doesn't get lynched rather than push for someone in between? I need to check Syls filter, so other than him who would you.choose as your number two lynch?
I see no reason not to pressure him. There are four scum players remaining and possible a third party, so top six is pretty likely to hit. I'd say he is probably around four-five right now. Like I said earlier, I'll go through the list of players when I get back from a wedding. Since you said you will be going through syls filter, that means you will be returning today to comment on him, correct? I could understand that you weren't completely active on day one, but now day two is almost half way over and you've still yet to comment on someone. You need to spend less time asking others their opinions and more time sharing your own.
On February 17 2013 03:34 iamperfection wrote: I could get behind a sylencia lynch
gogo vote.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 06:14 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2013 03:35 Dandel Ion wrote: Also, I want my role creator to claim. Right now. Hi.
Not me. We could probably figure it out by having everyone claim, but is it important enough to do so?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 10:10 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Lol Iamp mad. Sup guys I'm town. What should I do besides read like 40 pages of stuff?+
Take a look at Sylencia's filter and vote for him.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
Here are a few examples of Syl's town play. He is really competent when he wants to. Look how he is so open with his opinion and willing to push a lynch. Compare this to his day one lynch were he essentially says "meh I like BH's case" at the last minute. To me it seems like night and day.
On December 11 2012 18:34 Sylencia wrote:At work, decided to check in on what Oats had said before he got lynched, and now this is where I find yamato to be rather suspicious. A lot of posts made by Oats always ask about people's opinion on yamato. Why is he so intent on getting that information? Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 13:37 Oatsmaster wrote: What do you think about yamato voting you? Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 13:58 Oatsmaster wrote: So you are gonna ignore yamato's vote? Do you have a town/scum read on yamato? Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 14:31 Oatsmaster wrote: IMO Opinions help a lot in determining reads, so when Axle answered the question obliquely or not at all, it doesnt help yamato determine a read so yamato pressure votes Axle. its a pressure vote kickstart.
(Why does he feel the need to explain what yamato does when he is clearly capable of doing it himself) Show nested quote +On December 04 2012 20:38 Oatsmaster wrote: k cool. What do you think about kickstarts suspicion towards yamato? Also what do you think about yamato? The following posts after that are the ones where people begin to wonder - why did he say yamato was suspicious, then complete 180 and say he was town? Naturally, Oats also did mention Kickstart a lot, but that's because he was pushing for a mislynch to happen so that is only natural that the majority of the time Kick was being talked about by him. So here I wonder, was the plan on day 1 something like this, or did it eventually lead to this: - Everyone starts the game, and off the bat people are suspicious of yamato. - To help draw attention away, yamato stops posting and oats gets to work on a case against Kickstart instead, while also defending people suspecting yamato. - During all this, opinions on yamato are given when asked as this obviously helps the scum work out who they should take out first. - Oats continues his case against Kickstart, but at this point does the 180, and it really seems like he's now subtly putting it out there that yamato is innocent. - Case goes against oats now and he is lynched. In each of the days including the first, yamato has never changed his vote. A smart move, if he was scum because on the first day, going with the crowd would leave him with explaining to do, day 2 ended up with a no lynch, meaning there was a free kill for the scum in any case, and then finally we have day 3 - where him, Arn and I are the most suspicious ones of the group. Within the first few hours of the day he decides to target Arn, and we're left where we are. The majority of this case is based behind the actions of Oats, and I think that he has left enough clues to find the other member of the mafia team. This is the way I decided to look at it this time, and it is the way I am going to vote today. ##vote Yamato
On December 21 2012 22:39 Sylencia wrote:Alright, I've caught up to an extent, and I am pretty surprised to see so many people change their votes to Spag in the final 12 hours of the first day. At the present moment, I'm simply going through the possible ways in which we can use the vote count in our favour for finding the scum, since it's extremely unlikely that the mafia could cruise control to a free mislynch, there had to be some sort of bandwagoning happening. Also note that this doesn't mean I'm implicating Corazon as scum, as what Omni says does make sense, but I'm not going as far as to say he is 100% town. For the previous day, we have ourselves 7/13 (or 12 if you exclude Spag himself) people voting for Spag. Along the way, what we can take away from this is that there are scum scattered around this vote. The exact number is of course unknown, but to get the ball rolling it wouldn't be unreasonable to say there was at least 2 members voting for Spag here. Spaghetticus (7): Aquanim, OmniEulogy, Mocsta, cakepie, Kickstart, Chromatically, shz I've split the votes into 3 groups, the first 3, the next 2 and the final 2. To start with the final 2 votes: These final 2 votes were essentially making the lynch guaranteed, they could have stayed with their original vote, but decided to move over for their own reasons. shz: Very willingly bandwagoned both his votes on cora and Spag, very little analysis behind the reasoning other than not liking spag's defense, a little shady in my eyes, since Cora has quite a high chance of being town, and Spag being confirmed town. Chrom: Listed out his suspicions, but then also bandwagons onto Spag, only saying that the points were already raised by others, though there is a small explanation after. Still keeping my eye out, but isn't so bad. From the middle 2, the fact this area is where the balance of the votes changes, it's likely that at least one of the three could be scum. Kickstart: Hard to say, since it's a complete opposite to last game where he posted a lot and was very active, he did make a case, but it didn't really cover too much new information it was the same as what Aqua already said, just reflavoured. Cake: Reasonable points raised, only concern is the really weird part in the middle: Show nested quote +On December 21 2012 02:52 cakepie wrote:On December 20 2012 23:54 Chromatically wrote: If y'all won't go for FatChunk, though, I'm willing to go for Spag.
Let's do this thing for reals. Being the fourth vote, having Chrom move to Spag would pretty much call for a death sentence, since I was not around and Spag won't vote for himself meaning it would be a 5/11 vote count. Other than that, looks quite constructive and open with information. From the two in the middle, I would definitely say that Kick is on my watchlist, and while I'm not entirely sure on cake, I am inclined to say he is more likely to be town. First 3 - set the ball in action: Aqua - While I don't agree that posting rationally is scum, I think most of the points found were legitimate, and could've easily convinced me. In addition, Aqua is putting his neck on the line changing his vote from Cora to Spag. Only reasons to do this are: a) Legitimately believed he found the right tells b) Plan on voting Cora (implying he is also scum) but hoping the votes didn't roll in backfired - only considered because the vote was dropped so so early on. Plan b would be a really radical move to do, and I would believe in option A more, and so I'm more inclined to believe he has a higher chance of being town. Omni: So confused. If you were adamant about Cora being scum why would you go and change your vote? In my mind it makes little sense because the way you voted for Spag made it seem like you disregarded your strong thoughts on Cora and just moved straight onto Spag because he didn't rebound from Aqua's claims too well. Just stick to your reads because the reasons behind your vote on Spag were way too speculative compared to what you thought about Cora. Mocsta: Well thought out arguments, and during the day was bringing up a lot of discussion points, I like to think of Moc as more of a townie than scum at the moment. Now - naturally this list might not actually say too much but I am going to say that it is VERY unlikely for there to be (7+Spag)/9-10 townies vote for an innocent player. There had to be some manipulation going on in, it is just a matter of finding out who. If I had to list my two suspicions from the list - I would say I am suspecting Kickstart and Omni. There is something extra about Omni which doesn't feel right, I'm not completely sure what it is but I feel like there's something there. I'll post about the non-voters next, but this one took me a lot longer since I got distracted by 2 games of dota..
On December 20 2012 14:05 Sylencia wrote: Ok, I read the last few pages and at first I was liking shz's idea with the posting of the 'conclusions' that could be made if X player was lynched but as I was typing up some of the reasoning behind my thoughts I realised that it doesn't really make sense to do that - which is what Chrom said...
Corazon: Remember that while most of us are newbies, there are players who have obs'd a few games before this, and seen the inner workings on how scum players play, what newbies do and general scum reads. Putting it into practice is of course a lot harder though. But don't be intimidated by all that, just play your best game and hope for the best.
Now, for who I am going to vote for - at the moment my thoughts are actually quite split multiple ways. First, I said I wanted to vote threesr, but I feel like the behaviour displayed shouldn't be considered TOO deeply (but still considered of course) because while it annoys a lot of people, the statements made were mostly just noise. However, the unvoting and voting of different targets makes me feel uneasy, as everyone who he has voted for has been in the firing line at some point during the day, and I can't tell if it's a way to try pressure others into following suit by way of numbers or not.
In the case of voting for Corazon - this is the easy path for me, I can simply sheep and jump onto the corazon train but I don't know if that's the right way either. He was targeted early, but this was due to the lack of reads at the time and I think that scum have jumped onto the opportunity to get someone out easy, and honestly to me the thing with Corazon is that while he is defensive, he is still clear with what he is saying and is direct in replying to things which are targetted at him. Downside is he did make a slip, and it most definitely could've been subconciously done and I don't know if I should overlook that or not - since I learned from last game you should go with the most obvious pick from the most obvious reads. I chose to ignore it last time and I paid the price by losing us the game essentially.
Fatchunk I still have no idea about, I read his filter but I didn't get much from it.
I really hate this, but for now I am leaning towards Corazon, since I don't want to be ignoring 'obvious' tells like I did last game.
##Vote cDgCorazon
I can still change my vote for the next couple of hours before I leave but at the moment this is where I stand
On December 05 2012 19:03 Sylencia wrote: So pretty much at the moment, while catching up with all this drama that has happened in the past 5 or so hours, I've really become a lot more confused and a lot less sure who is actually scum and who is not.
Axle: Originally, I thought his acts of 'treat me nicely, I'm new' were actually quite suspicious, followed by really confusing posts which initially I believed were just posts to clog up the conversation and keep things disjointed. However, seems like as time goes on I understand what Axle is talking about less and less and now I don't even read the posts because it actually hurts my brain to try and understand the concepts he is talking about. Based off the responses you guys make to what he says, seems to be hard on you too. Basically, if I had no better read, I'd be picking Axle simply because I don't want to have to deal with working with an incomprehensible teammate.
Jidolboy: From what I have seen, all that has happened from him are a few answers and then a sudden vote. If I was to guess the way this game was going to go down, it would have the one person who is more active do the swaying, while the other lurks a bit more. As far as I can tell, Jidol has been the biggest lurker in the game so far, and then makes no effort in justifying what he has said. However, does that mean he's piggybacking onto CC, making him scum (assuming that Jidol is too)? Possibly, but probably not, if they were both scum, they wouldn't be picking out Oats I think, and instead piggyback onto the Kick vote.
Kick: This afternoon, I said that Kick is a townie because of his obnoxious behaviour. Rad and Oats continue the attack, and bring up rather relevant points, most of which I didn't consider (and also some points due to a past game which I didn't observe). However, at this point in time, I still believe that Kick is a townie, and so at this point in time I will not be voting for him.
yamato: More active than jidol, but still seems like lurking, and goes with the easy way out by voting Axle. Also noticed the disappearance after heat being applied on him but whether or not that's due to time zone, I'm not sure.
Now, between Rad and Oats, I feel like one is supporting the other, but at the same time, I also feel like one of them is doing so with the intention of swaying the other into believing they are on the same team. This round, I feel like I have to be voting for one or the other here. (Also, while I think that one or the other is scum, I do not think that both would be scum. They stand out far too much and have already essentially said "We are together in this fight", and that'd be some sick psychological tactics or some really newbie play if they were to be double scum)
In this case, I will be voting for Oats for two reasons: No lynch doesn't help us get any information. Worst case scenario means if we pick all townies to be lynched, we lose at the same rate as if we didn't lynch Day 1.
Between the two, Oats feels a lot more scummy to me. The main point in the end is the suspicion on yamato, followed by the 'scum read' on yamato, followed by a complete drop of the case against him, and then a complete dodge on answering why yamato was even suspected by him in the first place. Also, to me it seems like the case made when explaining why there was a vote for kickstart in the first place could also be applied to him. 1. At the time, yamato was still a suspect, so claims possible read 2. Notices no support for yamato's suspicion, backs out, and goes straight for Kickstart.
Naturally, I could be completely off track here, but I feel like the person who I should vote is for Oats.
##Vote Oatsmaster
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 17 2013 23:38 Vivax wrote: I think Kurumi's death deserves a kita lynch. We know for sure Kita wanted to kill Kurumi there. I don't think there's much more to add. He could have opted for guessing his alignment instead.
Take this with a grain of salt since I've still lots to read, but Kita lynch doesn't look disputable to me.
Explain to me how a 1:1 trade with kurmi makes sense as mafia? Killing kurumi puts me in the spotlight and causes a lot of people to be suspicious of me. As I explained before, if I were mafia, I could have picked pass, with no risk to myself and gone into d2 with next to no suspicion.
The reason I thought kurumi was scum is that he was using a detective/vig role on a player he appeared to trust (he agreed with my arguement on syl and we voted together). I thought that a town player with that role would 100% try to alignment check/vig the player they found to be the most scummy. It still doesn't make much sense to me why he didn't.
On February 15 2013 04:38 gonzaw wrote: I wouldn't mind lynching Hassy/Sylencia/Cheesecake
On February 15 2013 07:17 marvellosity wrote: And Sylencia is a gentleman of interest - the gentleman kitaman raised good points about the man.
On February 15 2013 08:15 marvellosity wrote: The man known as Sylencia I also believe may well have evil intentions. He continuously makes little chitter-chatter with other gentlemen, but only ever about his own person, and never unprompted. This is why looking at such gentlemen is not merely "policy".
On February 17 2013 11:47 Stutters695 wrote: Syls filter is worrying but I need to check his meta.
On February 17 2013 10:37 Crossfire99 wrote: I would also be willing to lynch sylencia today.
On February 16 2013 02:31 jcarlsoniv wrote: Yeah I could see sylencia being scum.
On February 17 2013 12:25 jcarlsoniv wrote: Syl's filter is really bad, and I would not be opposed to a lynch on him today.
It amazes me how many people think sylencia is scum, yet I have the same number of votes as him. Does nobody recognize the pushback we are getting here? People aren't willing to defend their scumbuddy, but conveniently decide not to vote for him right now.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 18 2013 00:05 Vivax wrote: You could have picked pass, since Kurumi seemed to have picked share information, he would have known your alignment.
That's not how the role works. Syl had it wrong in his post. If I picked pass, kurumi potentially could have given me his alignment. As mafia, a player sending me their alignment would have been absolutely no risk to me.
My thought process was that a town player with an alignment checker and a vig role, wouldn't be wasting their time using it on a player they thought was town. Let me ask you this: if you had the chance to alignment check or vig a player, would you use it on the player you thought was scum or town?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 18 2013 00:14 Dandel Ion wrote: Here's what I say happened: Scum kita saw he was confronted with the choice. Kurumi said he wasn't going to kill. Scum kita assumed kurumi would pick "pass" to learn his alignment. He didn't think it through and got announced the killer because kurumi made the correct choice for a townie to make, which is share, instead of pass.
That doesn't make sense dandel.
If scum kita assumes kurumi would pick pass, scum kita picks pass too. No alignments are swapped and he goes away with an "opps looks like we overlapped".
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 18 2013 00:19 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2013 00:17 kitaman27 wrote:On February 18 2013 00:14 Dandel Ion wrote: Here's what I say happened: Scum kita saw he was confronted with the choice. Kurumi said he wasn't going to kill. Scum kita assumed kurumi would pick "pass" to learn his alignment. He didn't think it through and got announced the killer because kurumi made the correct choice for a townie to make, which is share, instead of pass. That doesn't make sense dandel. If scum kita assumes kurumi would pick pass, scum kita picks pass too. No alignments are swapped and he goes away with an "opps looks like we overlapped". Hell no. Killing a townie "without any risk"? Sure you do that.
Without any risk? lol my name gets revealed as the killer. Of course there is risk. If I'm mafia a 1:1 trade simply makes zero sense. That's not this game works.
On February 18 2013 00:18 Dandel Ion wrote: But you were too afraid of dying. Too afraid for a townie to be. u scum son.
My role creator can confirm that I'm not afraid of dying. I thought kurumi was scum, I was wrong, and now people are taking advantage of my mistake, while ignoring the person that everyone thinks is scum, but doesn't want to lynch.
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 18 2013 00:18 Dandel Ion wrote: But you were too afraid of dying. Too afraid for a townie to be. u scum son.
In fact, that was the exact argument I used earlier for shooting kurumi. He refused to check syl because he was TOO AFRAID OF DYING. How come you're ignoring this?
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kitaman27
United States9244 Posts
On February 18 2013 00:30 Dandel Ion wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2013 00:23 kitaman27 wrote:On February 18 2013 00:19 Dandel Ion wrote:On February 18 2013 00:17 kitaman27 wrote:On February 18 2013 00:14 Dandel Ion wrote: Here's what I say happened: Scum kita saw he was confronted with the choice. Kurumi said he wasn't going to kill. Scum kita assumed kurumi would pick "pass" to learn his alignment. He didn't think it through and got announced the killer because kurumi made the correct choice for a townie to make, which is share, instead of pass. That doesn't make sense dandel. If scum kita assumes kurumi would pick pass, scum kita picks pass too. No alignments are swapped and he goes away with an "opps looks like we overlapped". Hell no. Killing a townie "without any risk"? Sure you do that. Without any risk? lol my name gets revealed as the killer. Of course there is risk. If I'm mafia a 1:1 trade simply makes zero sense. That's not this game works. As I said, you hoped/assumed he would Pass.
That is most certainly not what I said. You were using an example of where scum kita assumed pass and I was saying why it didn't make sense.
On February 18 2013 00:27 Dandel Ion wrote: Town thought process: Pass: I might learn his alignment, might get shot without an announcement. Okay, but undesireable.
Share: He might learn my alignment, he might be unveiled as my killer. Both desireable outcomes.
Kill: I can't get killed. I might kill him with a good chance of getting revealed. I have nothing more than a passing suspicion of some random post he did. Clearly the inferior option. I can't killed that night, but I've thrown away my protection for free (not going to roleclaim how my role works). I throw away a kp for a player I have a mafia read on
Scum thought process: Pass: I already know alignment, might get killed. Nope. Nope, I can't get killed. Best choice since its free
Share: He might learn my alignment. If he shoots me he gets confirmed town since he's announced killer. NOPENOPENOPE. Agreed. a scum player isn't choosing this option
Kill: Kills him. good chance of doing so without outing me, if he passes to learn my alignment. Best option for scum. Nope, you're confusing things again. Share outs me as the killer, not pass. A single kp isn't work a scum lynch
Corrections in red.
On February 18 2013 00:29 Dandel Ion wrote: Kita tell me why you didn't claim (or at least hint at it or breadcrumb) the shot on kurumi before the daypost?
Because that's a sign of you hoping you wouldn't be exposed you know.
Because I was at the hospital for most of the cycle. I sent my choice in and wasn't able to return at any point after I had to leave unexpectadly. You can even double check that I didn't post that cycle if you don't believe me.
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