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On January 05 2013 06:49 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 06:44 Lazermonkey wrote:On January 05 2013 06:42 Palmar wrote: This is a desperation claim, not to mention according to Ace logic that is always perfect, you should always lynch day 1 roleclaimers.
Don't unvote marv, kill that scummy bastard This game is not a normal game. If Marv is fakeclaiming, scum will take a severe blow by sacrificing KP. This is actually a good point. If marv is scum and fakeclaiming, then scum can't use their full 3 KP tonight. A scum team with a town marv as cop would 100% either kill marv or give up KP to roleblock him.
uh, kp gets rounded up doesn't it?
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On January 05 2013 07:00 BloodyC0bbler wrote: For those who don't know what that means, palmar is a goon.
I don't understand anything, so you should explain it to me even if you think I'm dumb as shit and not worth it right now.
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On January 05 2013 07:17 Promethelax wrote: Well fuck. Can someone not on a tablet ask in green if the mom role could have checked during the day?
BC isn't drazerk.
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On January 05 2013 07:25 Kurumi wrote: Since I did not write down that Town roles are the usual Night roles I added the rule now. I am sorry for the confusion - I thought it was precise enough because noone never asked.
oh what the fuck.
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On January 05 2013 08:04 Foolishness wrote: lol It's like everyone who looks suspicious has accused Tunkeg of being mafia
That's actually how I based a lot of my reads -_-
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On January 05 2013 22:34 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 08:14 HiroPro wrote:On January 05 2013 08:04 Foolishness wrote: lol It's like everyone who looks suspicious has accused Tunkeg of being mafia That's actually how I based a lot of my reads -_- @ HiroCould you expand on this one please ? Do you mean that mafia was pushing Tunkeg/Prom lynch, assuming he is town ? I would like to know how you had Tunkeg as town ?
Sure. His attitude and tone in regards to "vets" and general play overall were exactly what I expected from his town play after the last game he was in. The reads post that he made seemed genuine and resembled how he has posted in the past.
Tunkeg is a very easy target to attack as mafia (I've done it myself), and none of the people who said that he was suspicious ever presented any good reasons for why he was mafia. The only person who ever tried to make anything resembling a case was debears, and his post was complete nonsense.
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Day vigi shots will be happening soon i expect.
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Cheesecake still has not delivered anything correct? So we lynch him after this.
##Vote Jackal
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Yes because people would obviously be inclined to think that Jackal is town after how he's played so far....
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On January 07 2013 07:19 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 07:16 VisceraEyes wrote: Djo's Hiro Case Honestly, there's not much there. First of all, the whole "KP are rounded up" thing is IN the OP. I don't understand what extra information you're saying Hiro has to have to make that correction, but the KP formula is in the OP so that whole point doesn't make sense to me.
The froggy thing is also strange, but mostly because I had a similar thought process. At the time, I was about sure Tunkeg was town based on the vehemence of his posting and general unpleasantness...angry townies lynch people, so if Tunkeg were scum I'd think he'd be more afraid of posting like a jerkwad. Anyone tunneling Tunkeg D1 was pretty suspicious to me for this reason...so it's not unreasonable to me that Hiro saying that someone coming out of a Tunkeg tunnel gets townpoints.
The point about him discrediting one townie while lynching another is a good point though. This and him blending in are the points I agree with in your case. The thing about the KP being rounded-up is that the OP mentions only the formula for the total KP scum is having at his disposition. What we didn't know is that the remaining KP was also rounded-up. And Hiro was knowing this ! Look the nested quote, he was saying that marvellosity claim was not a problem for scum because they could RB him and still have 3 KP, which shows that he knows how to use mafia KP !
Kurumi explained it later in the thread.
On December 29 2012 02:01 Kurumi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 29 2012 01:32 Toadesstern wrote: Oh another thing I just realized: Do mafias have to deliver the KP?
As in: I'm the last mafia alive, I have 1KP, do I have to visit someone to punch him in the face or is it being delivered automatically without me doing something? If I HAVE to deliver the KP, can I deliver other amounts of damage? Like 2 people doing 0.5KP instead of 1 doing 1KP. Or one doing 3KP instead of 3 doing 1KP? If I HAVE to deliver the KP, can I do other things as well? Example: 1KP left, I want to sac 0.5KP for a PR and still punch someone for 0.5KP worth of damage. Can I do both? Mafia can at any point abstain from using their KP. They can even shoot team mates if they so desire. You can do both actions because you're crafty and night is quite long during the winter. You CAN'T attack with 0.5 KP(because you do have a full 1). Mafia of 5 starts with 2.5KP. If they want not to use it for roles, they might deliver 3KP of damage (since KP is rounded up). Since there is no Watchers, Trackers, Bullet Bills or any other funny roles like roleblocker it doesn't matter if you do or don't decide who's delivering the KP.
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On January 07 2013 06:46 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 06:35 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:On January 07 2013 06:26 VisceraEyes wrote: Until we kill 2 scum. With 5 scum KP is still 3. Well with 5 they can only dayvig twice and then have to kill or else buy two 0.5 roles at the cost of a dayvig. I could live with that. What? KP is still 3 with 5 scum...meaning they can dayvig twice, buy a .5 and NK the same way (we're assuming) they did last night. Being down one means nothing in terms of what they can do...it's not until they're down two that they're impeded in any way.
This is wrong. They'll have 2.5 and then be rounded after they use whatever powers they choose to sac for.
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On January 07 2013 07:30 Djodref wrote: He said "if they want not to use it for roles" What you were saying is that they could use it for one role, and still get the 3 KP because the remaining part gets round-up. And I think that only mafia has this information.
Im going to help you learn how to read since Im feeling nice.
You CAN'T attack with 0.5 KP(because you do have a full 1).
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It helps if you read Toads post also.
If I HAVE to deliver the KP, can I do other things as well? Example: 1KP left, I want to sac 0.5KP for a PR and still punch someone for 0.5KP worth of damage. Can I do both
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On January 07 2013 08:12 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 07:35 HiroPro wrote:It helps if you read Toads post also. I f I HAVE to deliver the KP, can I do other things as well? Example: 1KP left, I want to sac 0.5KP for a PR and still punch someone for 0.5KP worth of damage. Can I do both Well, it looks like Toad had forgot he has asked this question because he didn't mention this when we were discussing why iamp had been shot at night and not by a day vig. Why did you not make any comment on our discussion at that point ?
I wasn't around.
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they're pretty recent. I've been reading for some time.
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On January 08 2013 05:36 Promethelax wrote: do you seriously only have town reads on dead guys? Of your scum reads which would be your top lynch tomorrow?
hm? sentinel, perfection, grush, vivax, Palmar, yamato, yourself, and lazermonkey.
I'd lynch cheesecake.
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We're going to lynch Cheesecake. I don't care whether you guys think that he is so inconsiderate that he would abandon one game completely to join another one. He is around, he is avoiding being modkilled by voting, but refusing to do anything at all so you have to lynch him.
##Vote Cheesecake
Now let's talk about Toadesstern, since you guys are ignoring him.
These are the posts with regards to his view on Palmar that I will be referring to:
+ Show Spoiler +On January 04 2013 02:10 Toadesstern wrote: ##vote Palmar
Let's get this going. Town palmar can be a dick, Town palmar can and will be very much trollish, Town palmar however won't do everything that's possible to make it sure it's hard for town to get reads on people or to even read the thread. That's something not-Town Palmar does.
Get lynching guys. On January 04 2013 03:48 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 03:43 HiroPro wrote:/yawn. still dull toad, still dull. he's overdoing it though. Almost feels like Batman-Palmar... Town palmar however won't do everything that's possible to make it sure it's hard for town to get reads on people or to even read the thread. That's something not-Town Palmar does. I'd like some proof for these statements. Arkham City: Palmars filterAnd well about the first statement. I obviously can't prove he doesn't do that as town because that's impossible. Thing is I haven't seen him doing anything this extreme as town, and I've seen him a couple of times. Gosh you're wasting my time I'm off to McD for half an hour. On January 04 2013 04:37 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 04:23 HiroPro wrote: I want an actual explanation with some quotes and analysis, not a useless filter link.
not going to happen On January 04 2013 04:40 Toadesstern wrote: and I'm not paranoid. I'm gauging the situation :p Though I really am not sure what to make of Palmar, which is troublesome.
So what do we see here - Toad is voting for Palmar on some sort of meta read, but has absolutely no desire to explain it beyond "Palmar isn't like this is town. this is not-town Palmar". What motivations could a town Toad have for not willing to explain in detail why the person he's voting for should be lynched? He could either have an inherent dislike for explaining his thoughts or it could be a pressure vote (It's clear that this is not a pressure vote based on how quickly Toad drops the whole thing). At the same time, Toad has no problems with complaining about how marv won't share his thinking with him, so it's very unlikely that Toad doesn't like to explain his thoughts on his lynch target. So then the simplest explanation is that Toad is mafia and does not want to share his reasoning because he simply has nothing substantial.
On January 04 2013 06:00 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 04 2013 05:38 marvellosity wrote:On January 04 2013 05:36 Toadesstern wrote:On January 04 2013 05:29 yamato77 wrote: Toad what are you serious about? not much yet. I don't want to die n1 again. I know, won't happen with this stacked of a playerfield but you can't be safe enough, can you? :p I mean, I'm serious with my reads and all that and I'm pretty sure I got some decent ones right now. I'm just not telling you and I have no intention of looking like I'm serious in here :p I just really don't like lynching into those people Marv wants to lynch into because they tend to flip like someone spinning a wheel of fortune instead of flipping their true alignment. well until you're willing to share your great wisdoms, why don't you just shut the hell up complaining at other people? seriously what's wrong with people this game. I asked you why you'd want to lynch into the guy in particular because I wouldn't be that comfortable lynching into him myself. I get that I might be a bit less on the serious side this game but I'm not being an ass here. You answered the question and that's all there is to it. I never said you're bad or scummy or anything for approaching the situation the way you are, I merely wanted to hear your thoughts about it and yet again I'm getting this kind of "piss off" answer from someone, I haven't figured you out yet, which is the reason I'm asking for your reasoning... that's not complaining at other people as far as I'm concerned.
At the same time, the speed with which Toad's view on Palmar changes should be highly concerning. At 2:10, Toad is voting for Palmar and calling him very likely "not-town". Yet just 2.5 hours later, Toad suddenly is unsure about Palmar (It should be noted that Palmar has posted nothing in this time frame beyond expressing a slight doubt of Toad) and seems ready to back off. What could possibly cause this shift - at this time, I'm questioning Toad on his reasoning and supersoft is calling Toad paranoid and saying Palmar will absolutely not be lynched. Yet, Toad's response isn't to loudly refute us (which would be the normal drama queen toad reaction), but instead something that smells much more strongly of mafia - avoiding discussion and instead attempting to quitely appease others.
Now let's look at the way that Toad treats Viscera (relevant quotes are in the spoiler):
+ Show Spoiler +On January 05 2013 03:49 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 03:43 Promethelax wrote: Oh, I see we're in lynch cycle.
Can anyone link me to cases against the lynch targets? And a vote count?
Also, CC, why the fuck are you seeping debears (whose name becomes defeats on my tablet) did the dude suddenly shoot sun beams out of his ass? 'Cause until that point sleeping him with out adding anything is about as smart as humping a hole in a brick wall. d1. We're lynching marv right now, mostly because Palmar said so and people like Supersoft and myself agree about it. Alternatives would be a policy lynch on WBG, A lynch on me because I'm weird according to VE (?) A lynch on BC because... I don't know hard to tell... I agree he's not looking good but I wouldn't be comfortable lynching him A lynch on VE for doing stuff other people want to do ALL THE TIME On January 05 2013 05:46 Toadesstern wrote: I really think any kind of lynch between Marv / BC / Hopeless / maybe VE would be awesome right now.
But Palmars the man and he says it's Marv and not the other 3 guys, so Marv it is. On January 04 2013 07:46 Toadesstern wrote: the interessting thing, if at all is VE's vote. Though VE and I have somewhat of a history so it's really hard to get something out of that...
I don't mind foolish to be honest. On January 05 2013 09:09 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 09:03 Vivax wrote:On January 05 2013 02:44 VisceraEyes wrote: I just don't know anymore. I wanted to lynch you until you told me the bit about being disappointed and why, but thinking back it would have been easy as fuck to cater than answer to me. So I'm now taking it as null and by extension you as null too. Palmar's case is missing stuff - like the fact that this is your median activity/contribution level D1s regardless of alignment, and the fact that a town marv (who respects Palmar's ability as a player) WOULD want to lynch Palmar...but like Toad, it's been at the exclusion of everything else.
And because I should be pretty obviously town to you, and because my sheeping shouldn't come as a surprise to ANYONE REGARDLESS of my alignment, least of all you, I wish you luck with the mob. I won't be adding my vote to the tally just yet, that's the extent of my effort in your defense. Dude, is VE chronically affected by sheepitis? If so, then why does Toad find him strange despite knowing him for longer? Can anybody confirm this statement? VE is problematic and plays somewhat anti-town no matter of alignment. Palmar once said that VE is one of the strongest mafia-aligned-forces no matter of alignment, resulting in town being at a disadvantage no matter what. That was before he started playing better. Nevertheless he's VERY eratic. He's either good or completly moronic. Pretty much nothing inbetween, which makes it hard to judge him. I've got a history with him because he'll probably tell you that I consider him scummy every game I play with him, no matter of our alignments, even if we're both mafia :3 So basicly you won't find a game of VE in which he's not strange, not a single one. The question is wether that strange is something bad strange. On January 06 2013 07:00 Toadesstern wrote: I'm going to make a bold statement here: I don't think I'm going to get doublestacked n1 again.
I really don't think mafia will shoot me, but I might have overdone it a little because apparently there's a bunch of paranoid people who might be willing to shoot me. I'm mainly looking at hopeless, Ex-Tunk (?) and VE here. Tunk is unlikely simply because he replaced out but who knows. Hopeless could end up shooting me and if he does it's probably a townie-move although being utterly retarded because I really don't see mafia wasting KP on me this game, this early on, especially with Marv flipping town. If VE shoots me it's a null I guess... he'd be crazy enough to do that as both alignments and to claim it as both alignments. If he's mafia he could easily be sitting in his QT yelling <i>"look guys, if I shoot Toad and claim 10 secs prior to deadline I'll totally look like a misguided townie and with me yelling at Toad 10 times d1 I have all the reasoning to shoot him while making me look VE-ish!"</i>. I however could also see him do the same thing as town so no idea about him.
I guess the best thing is to see who get's shot at deadline, that should give as some hints because right now it's really confusing within the vets. And I really hope possible vigs end up claiming prior to deadline.
That's all that's relevant for this particular deadline from my point of view. I'm playing some zelda and will get onto more important things tomorrow. On January 10 2013 00:46 Toadesstern wrote: On the offchance that I'm pulling a WBG here, I'd rather not vote Debears. Who's an option besides him? I somewhat want VE dead, I somewhat want foolish dead but have no idea what's the status with his logs.
Throughout his filter, Toad is clamoring for VE to be lynched on absolutely nothing (read it, you won't find a single reason for why VE might be mafia). Everything about his tone and attitude (specifically the constant double-talk where multiple explanations are given for VE's behavior but no real opinion is ever taken) suggest that Toad regards VE as some sort of oddity, not a prime lynch candidate. So then why is Toad pushing for VE to be lynched all the time? It's simply a baseless mafia push - Toad is content to throw dirt at VE without ever trying to really convince others.
I'll be around for another half an hour, so talk to me right now please. Viscera, I would very much appreciate it if I could talk with you.
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That was way after what I'm discussing.
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