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[QUOTE]On October 08 2012 09:48 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: [QUOTE]On October 08 2012 09:04 debears wrote: As an FYI, I am done defending my actions. I will be lynched. I don't care. I'm in full attack mode.
[QUOTE]On October 08 2012 05:40 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: Steaming off a bit I have no idea what your town motivations would be, Debears. How did you switch so fast between SS being scum and onto me? Your case against starts with you saying both of us are likely scum and somehow ends with you being willing to bet anything on me being scum. It makes no sense unless it's a scum desperation move.[/QUOTE]
Where in God's name did I say you thought Boson was scummy?[/QUOTE]
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Nice attempt to lie and get away with it. Luckily I'm not retarded and I'm not desperate
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On October 08 2012 12:20 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 08 2012 12:06 debears wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 08 2012 09:45 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 08 2012 09:00 debears wrote:First, SDM SDM, you suddenly found me to be a townie after d2's lynch. Let me go back and examine why. + Show Spoiler +On October 03 2012 01:34 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:About the Debears case: My argument for wanting to lynch Alsn instead of Debears is that between the two of them, I think Debears' motivations are less clearly scummy. While I feel like Debears has been acting like I would expect scum to act in a lot of the situations he’s been in, that doesn't make his motivations exclusively scummy. As an example, I've found Debears smoothly jumping Kush's wagon to be suspcious, but reading Debears' filter I don't end up convinced that's the case. For this to be suspicious, it requires the assumption that he had dropped his initial suspicions. Looking back at his posts around that time, I don't think that's clear: + Show Spoiler +On September 28 2012 13:24 debears wrote: Our main goal is to lynch mafia. Yes, kush has said some scummy things. However, I'm not gonna go around parading this early saying "kush is scum. Kush is scum. OMFG".
Also, let the man defend himself instead of trying to rally everyone active behind your cause so early. If he is scummy, the votes will come.
Anyhow. I see two others who have suspiciously posted.
I'm pretty sure I've made similar arguments myself, that we gain more information by focusing on multiple suspects. The same can be said for him dropping his suspicion on Djo. Throwing out light suspcicions early on in order to get things started isn't really anti-town. Looking back at his original case, he doesn't seem to push it that hard and honestly I don't find the inconsistency of dropping it as weird as a lot of others seem to: + Show Spoiler +On September 28 2012 13:24 debears wrote:@DjorefShow nested quote +On September 28 2012 08:51 Djodref wrote: @Darthpunk
Nevermind you look just more confident to get a scum on D1 than me.
Regarding my plan, I think we need general directions to follow because of the majority lynch. It is a way to gather everybody around 2-3 suspicious players and secure a lynch. I'm assuming everyone agree on a no-lynch to be stupid.
Djoref, I don't like that statement at all. That's the second post you bring up about the likelihood of lynching a townie d1. As town, you should never have that mentality. I would probably less likely to bring this up if you were a total nooby. However, you said you "know Kush's meta" which means you have some decent understanding of the game for a noob. By saying this, it seems that you are setting yourself an excuse to be indecisive later in the day when the lynch voting comes around. Alone, it isn't much. However, your other posts don't help. Show nested quote +On September 28 2012 08:44 Djodref wrote: @Darthpunk
Considering that we are likely to lynch a town on D1, don't you think it's a lesser wrong to get rid of someone inactive ? Inactivity means no scumhunt and room to hide for the mafia...
After playing mafia last game, I feel like heavy lurking is a bad play for mafia. It puts too much pressure on you are as a scum. Instead, posting lightly without much substance is more mafia indicative. Yet again, I feel you are just looking like you are contributing without saying much. Especially when you already covered your thoughts in a previous post. Show nested quote +On September 28 2012 08:36 Djodref wrote:Hello everybody ! About meThis is my first game ever on forum but I've been playing on SC2mafia and also irl. But I've been lurking on the TL Mafia forum for a while (so I know your meta kush^^) and I decided to join this newbie game. I'm also a French guy and I live in Korea so my english is not on top and it's going to ne difficult for me to be around at deadline (5.00 am KST). Lurker policyFrom the games I've seen, unless you have a golden scumslip on d1, it's very difficult to lynch a scum the very first day. So I have no problem ending up voting for the most suspicious lurker at the end of the day. I define most suspicious lurker as a semi-lurker just trying to blend in.Day PlanI don't think to be able to be around for the first deadline so I would like to propose a day plan to secure a lynch as we are using a majority vote. First 24 hours to find lynch candidates while scumhunting and next 20 hours to decide who is the scummiest. Last 4 hours to consolidate the vote or switch to a lurker. Please discuss Notice how you are just repeating points? It isn't helpful to us. Next post Show nested quote +On September 28 2012 11:09 Djodref wrote:@Kush thank you now I won't be nk Was it also a joke ? How can you be so sure you are not going to be NKed ? A two sentence, two question post. I don't like these. They are worthless. Also, this question came quite a bit later after darthpunk already was asking questions about joking. You seem to be sheeping onto darth's case against kush. Show nested quote +On September 28 2012 11:53 Djodref wrote:On September 28 2012 11:22 kushm4sta wrote:
Because the most active townie is tunneling me?
I would also like to hear you explanations about this specific part. I don't have a read on Darth on the moment considering he has only been hard tunneling you. As you said yourself you have a scummy meta so you are an easy target for early game to put pressure on. So what makes him so much town ? Yet again, this post is just repeating what darth is saying. Another question. I don't like this. Your early posts are indicative of a semi-active scum. Sheeping, question posts, and rehashing things already said multiple times. Basically I think a lot Debears actions look scummy, but it's not farfetched to see various possible motivations in them. You can argue for a convergence of evidence type case, that when a lot of weaker evidence is pointing in the same direction, there’s often something to it. I think that’s a valid argument and barring scum slips like Kush’s that’s often how scum is found, but I don't think Debears’ story is as incoherent as Alsn’s. I think both have perfectly reasonable “scum stories”, but I find Debears' "town explanations" more believable.If I look at Debears’ story, I can see reasonable explanations for his actions. If I look at Alsn’s story, I just don’t see how I’d ever reach his conclusions. He’s defending Kush with arguments I find weird and I think those can easily be the result of artificially searching them (scum) rather than just naturally reacting (town). Alsn is also more clearly contradicting himself in my opinion. Particularly the part where, despite his introduction post d1, he’s still not liking a Kush lynch on d2 (aka Act IV). Then, your next post that talks about me more than one line. + Show Spoiler +On October 03 2012 20:43 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: I don't know what to make of Debears post-d2 posts because it's putting me in total WIFOM mode and I should probably just ignore it.
But disregarding his last posts which obviously could be the result of leveling, is his case stronger than the one I just made? Maybe it's the excitement of novelty, but really? At least I'd say Debears play has been way more pro-town. He has his scummy-looking inconsistneies for sure, but at the same time he was aggressive d1. He tried making cases, get the thread started. He took attention because he was willing to, compare that to Omni who's just cruising by. At least I encourage you to pop out of the Debears bubble we've all been in to look at it.
Also, to Debears benefit, does scum really hang on this long when faced by pages and pages of accusations? I know I gave in quickly in XXVI because it seemed pointless. And look at Kush's reaction. That's the only examples I have myself from experience, maybe Debears is different. And maybe you can question if a townie would hang in this long. At least Alsn did. Ok let's summarize your reasons for me seeming town. 1) I was aggressive d1 2) Scum doesn't hang on that long faced with pages of accusation Two pretty piss poor reasons to view me as town, especially when you say that I definitely have my scummy looking inconsistencies. Also, based on your argument earlier, right now I am town. I am being extremely aggressive and active. I have the spotlight. And I am hanging on and contributing what I can before I get lynched while looking scummy. Contradiction no? Here is the main thing that showed me that SDM is scum. The rest of the my original case is stuff I found looking back hard at his filter.The Lynch or Lack ThereofThe events leading up to the lynch are a major scumslip in my book on SDM, He shriveled up into an indecisive shell at last moment. Yet, he wanted it that way. On October 02 2012 19:55 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:On October 02 2012 18:10 DarthPunk wrote: Also. We need to consolidate on Either Alsn or Debears. I am happy with either. Would mildly prefer a debears lynch. But I think both are scummy as shit.
So. Who are we going to Consolidate onto? Z- Boson? SDM? thoughts?
I'm leaning Alsn and I'm hoping to have time to explain why with a good amount of time to the lynch. I agree about the consolidating, but I don't think we're in a hurry. With an early concensus it's easier for scum to blend in, whereas if we wait they'll potentially face the pressure of a bus or save situation (or wait until the last minute to make a decision, which is scummy looking). . However, when it comes to the situation he wants, a last minute switch, he refuses to lynch me to gain information based on the sudden vote changes, which could immensely help the town. 1) It clears the confusion over me being scum or town 2) It gives a better indication of who is scum based on the reaction to the sudden voteswing. On October 06 2012 04:22 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:How many are still around? And wtf happened to Boson? He dropped a huge ass case and then poof. Still nothing on who we should lynch. Just asking if people are around. On October 06 2012 04:16 RemedySC wrote: Well Z-bo or Debears would probably give us the most information, since Omni is likely to be modkilled.
What do you think SDM? My biggest scum read is set up for a modkill. Shady just got peeked and I wasn't entirely convinced before hand either. Next on my list would be Debears but I haven't given him much thought today until all this happened. Wasn't convinced about the Boson case and my state of mind isn't optimal for great decision making right now. I wouldn't mind a no lynch. Look hard at this post. Look really hard. He knows his biggest scum read is going to get modkilled at this point, yet his still wants to vote for him. He says he doesn't know on Shady. And finally, HE HASN"T GIVEN LYNCHING ME MUCH THOUGHT AFTER I WAS A HEADLINE ALL GAME IN THE SCUMREADS UNTIL RIGHT BEFORE LYNCH????That is bs. Total bs. He is definitely lying there. Alright. Let's summarize his lynch thoughts 1) Indecisive 2) Wants a No lynch 3) Becomes extremely confused 4) Disappears right after his WTF post Now, let's look at townie and mafia motivations 1) Town - He is actually confused. He believes that SS and Me might be town. He believes that Omni may still pop up. Problems with this thought - We all said we would be willing to switch back to Omni if he suddenly showed up to avoid modkill. But btw SS and me, town has to lynch one of us! SS might be town or might be scum. Either way, we need to clarify his alignment. The same is for me (from your guy's angle since you think I'm scum, I am town). SDM knows this. By taking out one of us, it would have led to more information for town at a stage where we can afford a mislynch. I needed 1 more vote for a lynch. Yet, SDM sits there, suddenly becoming the most indecisive player in the world despite what appeared to be a very good game in which everyone saw him as town. 2) Mafia - By keeping, SS and me(especially me) around, a mafia has the opportunity to take advantage of the confusion it will create for town. He can get away with nks that will easily be blamed on me and SS until our alignments are cleared up. He can act on the confusion in the thread and hide behind not forcing a vote (despite the fact that he stated earlier that he wanted a last minute vote situation). Finally, @SDM WHY DID YOU NOT GO OVER MY FILTER AT ALL DURING ALL OF DAY 3 WHEN YOU SAID MY ACTIONS WERE SCUMMY AND I WAS THE OTHER MAIN LYNCH CANDIDATE? WHY DID YOU NOT VOTE ME RIGHT BEFORE LYNCH, THEN DISAPPEAR AFTER A MOVE THAT WOULD BE STUPID FOR A TOWNIE TO MAKE? WHY WAS YOUR VOTE PARKED ON OMNISCIENT WHO WE KNEW WOULD GET MODKILLED? Remember, Z-Bo, SS, and RSC, mafia make mistakes too. I feel that this was a HUGE scumslip by SDM. Look at his rebuttal post. HE DOES NOT MENTION THE MAIN POINT OF MY ARGUMENT AGAINST HIM. Why? BECAUSE HE IS SCUM AND HE KNOWS I'M RIGHT. HE HAS NO DEFENSE. + Show Spoiler +On October 08 2012 04:23 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:I'm up to date again. Seriously Debears, wtf? Your case reeks of desperation. I don't get how on earth you end up getting me associated with Kush. It seems to me Kush was less inflammatory against people not cursing at him or telling him he was scum in bolded, red versals. That might have something to do with it, I don’t know. What a weird argument coming from someone who tried to avoid pushing Kush despite him looking scummy as hell. Overconfidence: I'm not sure you understood what made me suspicious of you in XXVII. XXVII stuff in here: + Show Spoiler +One part was because you made a lengthy defense of thrawn for no real reason. I think this was the legit part. The other part was something I still think was a genuine misunderstanding (thrawn's intentions), which was why I thought the case was made weaker. My #1 scum read d1 was Sharrant. I really liked that case and it had 2-3 good motivations behind it. After I was killed off n1 I just followed the game in the Obs QT. On d2 I was confident Stutters was scum. On d3 I was confident Atreides was scum. So basically all my 3 strongest reads in XXVII turned out wrong. You couldn't know this because you were still in the game so I'll give you a pass on this one, but this is all in the XXVII Obs QT. Time and indecision: Shady's post on Boson pissed me off at first because he had been dodging my questions for a long while. I responded barely reading his case because given the quality of his earlier cases I was sure it was complete crap. When Shady started replying I realized I had to go back to understand wtf he was talking about, as anyone can see my attempts in replying to him were just messed up at first. Open-ended answers: Seriosuly, what kind of argument is this? In the first bolded part it's clear I think (based on my experience) it's less likely for scum to hang on for this long. But since my experience is limited to two games I was looking for opinions from others as well. The second bolded part, I just don't think the argument they were making held much weight and it made sense to point that out. Contributions: I thought Djo came off scummy d1/n1 and I pointed it out. In the end I thought Boson's cases made more sense. Considering the validity of other cases kind of seemed to be a good idea. And I don't get why you'd say my Omni case wasn't original or at least added a lot of weight to it with new argumetns. About Alsn, wtf? My arguments against him wasn't based on him pointing out that focusing on others would be good for town, but that he was directly defending him (read my post again) using weird arguments. I by no means "cleared" you because you suggested focusing on others, but at least it could have town motivations. Indecisive again: I was being indecisive here for sure. How on earth wouldn't I be? If you go read my d3 filter I basically never considered you for lynch d3. I was highly suspicious of Omni and Djo, quite suspicious of Shady and had moments of doubts wrt Boson. In the end Omni was likely to head for modkill, Djo just claimed cop, Shady had been peeked and I decided the Boson case was weak. All of a sudden all my d3 considerations had gone out the window. And at this point you expect me to me mr decisive? Last time I pushed a last minute switch I hadn't thought over I caused the mislynch of Drazak. When i got back all hell had broken loose. The only thing I had time to react to was that Boson had seemingly become a lynching target and claimed vet. Lynching him made no sense at all. And somewhere you also argue that my recent absence from the thread is somehow scummy? Gah, how is all this not just an act of desperation? ##Vote Debears I have made big cases on every single person in this game besides Lesrah and RSC. I have not shared most of them with you guys. Why? Because I only present ones that make the most sense to me. OUT OF ALL MY CASES THIS GAME, THIS ONE MAKES THE MOST SENSE. Jesus, read my filter. The second post of mine is arguing why I think Omni is more suspicious, not proclaiming you as town. I also said we needed to focus on others because we had been discussing you for a week. Show nested quote +On October 04 2012 20:59 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: We've been discussing the Debears case for almost a week now, it's about time we focus on others. I'll get back with thoughts when we're getting closer to EOD. I never did, because when Shady stumbles into the thread with all kind of messy posts, I got more suspicious of him. Show nested quote +On October 05 2012 20:44 Sonic Death Monkey wrote: Besides I'm more suspicious of this Shady guy than I am of Debears atm. I also had to make up my mind on Boson because the final Shady case made kind of some kind of sense (so i checked the d2 voting and after that considered it weak). Djo came off as weird as well d3, I didn't know what to make of him jumping on the Shady's silly ideas instantly. And he was being quite insistant on his town read on Omni eventhough I found that case really good (finally giving in and voting on him because it'd make him post better). I didn't know what to make of that and closer to EOD I checked Djo's filter as suggested by Boson. This is where my focus was. When it all finally blew up with the cop claim, I had put no focus on you whatsoever and was quite happy to make sure my #1 scum read would get killed off. If he didn't flip red we'd still be in a good d4 situation where we actually could think things over instead of having a repeat of the Drazak fuck up. And I addressed this in my last post, I just didn't spell it all out in detail because it's all in my fucking filter that you've supposedly read. This is a bs excuse. You thought my actions were scummy, yet you never in d3 looked at my filter? What kind of scumhunting is that? The only reason i don't check someones filter at least once a cycle is if i am pretty sure they are town. Why in the hell would you not check my filter if you are town, if you found me scummy, and if you are actually scumhunting. Hell even when i had a town read on you i checked your filter from this game and other games. You're argument makes no sense from a townies perspective. You're no lynch makes no sense from a townie perspective. I'm getting tired of this. I don't have the time to check everyone's filter every cycle. Who the fuck has the time to do that? I try to focus on what is important, which was peolpe we hadn't discussed for a week straight. I'm trying to look at townie motivations for what you're doing, but I can see none. If you really are townie, where the hell did your SS suspicions go? The trap you set? Or the fact that he was completely missing from the last minute lynch talk? Him leaving his vote on Boson then disappearing, nearly causing a mislynch, convinced you he was townie?
Another "i don't have time excuse". Its not that hard to loom over a persons filter and have a base judgement on whether they are acting scummy or not. Why do you keep making poor excuses for your lack of effort to look at someone that almost everyone thought was scummy? You know who do that? Mafia.
As i said earlier, I'm getting lynched. I don't care and I'm not explaining my actions. You are scum and yiu need to be lynched after i am for town to win
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O.o that was ss. Ill conced on th zbo thing. However, ss will be in th spotlight, considering he is the other main lynch candidate. But you haven't had it. And your scum defense of not looking at my filter and not voting me are terrible
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Wow shady. Are you even reading the thread?
You dont find sdms actions suspicious at all?
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Really? The zbo part yeah. Not the part about the scumhunting and the no lynch suggestion.
Have you guys forgotten there isn't a medic? So the less lynches the mafia has to commit to, the more easy nks they get?
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If I could save time in a bottle The first thing that I'd like to do Is to save every day Till Eternity passes away Just to spend them with you
Just a pre death thought I wanted to share with all of you.
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Its null leaning scummy. He said early in the game he wasnt going to lurk. Then he went ahead and did it anyways
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Gg guys. Ill explain why i went ape shit today after the game.
Gl town
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@SDM
Hell of a game as scum. Yeah if you lynched me d3 you would've most likely had it in the bag. I was actually afk during the last 10-20 minutes of that lynch (or hour and 20) so I was fully expecting to be lynched. When it was you that didn't put in the final vote, everything just clicked cuz I know you are way better than that as town
Also, the open ended answers thing was something I believed I notice in ver's XXX analysis. On the posts I quoted you just ran in a circle with your thought and didn't really make a statement. I might be wrong on this. Marv or Hapa any input on that point?
@everyone
GG! GJ DP (I'm still pissed at myself since you caught onto kush way before me :/ Hell of a job with the d1 lynch), Z-Bo (way to close it out), and the rest of town!
Thanks to prplhz and thrawn for hosting. Thanks marv for the advice!
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Awww rly? I just signed up for bugs mini
Maybe ill just concentrate less on the newbie
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On October 11 2012 00:17 Sonic Death Monkey wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2012 22:19 marvellosity wrote: I would like to note that SDM's bus of kush isn't as 'obvious' as it may seem in hindsight.
Especially in newbie games, scum players have a really hard time bussing players decisively (or at all). And even in relation to non-newbie games, the early timing of the bus was impressive and something many scum players aren't capable of.
Good scum play is often fast thinking and decisive, like that bus. The beautiful flip side to this is SDM's actions at the no-lynch where he was confused and indecisive and got caught for it. Yeah, my bus probably wasn't too bad. After I get caught doing something really stupid d3 it's easy to go back and make up a good scum rationale for everything I did. I feel like it's equal part logic and confirmation bias, kind of like how Debears and Boson interpreted my absence from the thread: 1) Debears used it to argue I was really scared2) Boson used it to argue I was really confidentThey make the same observation, their analyses of it are polar opposite but their conclusions are still the same: I'm scum. In reality I never avoided the thread on purpose (at least not for the long stretches of time in question).
I wasn't (at least intentionally) saying that you were scared. I found it awkward (if you were town) to suddenly disappear after a giant amount of confusion without explaining why you did what you did, especially when Z-Bo called you out for bad town play.
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And yeah the whole town cred for the vote is just inexperience.
I figured early on that the first 3 voting for kush (first 2 considering darth revoked his vote) wouldn't have decided to bus kush so early since kush could play off it as his meta
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A Second case on Djo
Since my first case, Djo hasn't done much to help my read on him. In fact, after rereading his filter again, I'd say my scumread on him is even stronger.
Points in the original case/cases
1) Stated and Acted as though he had a town read on me day 1, then denies it when pressured by Rad 2) His two scumslips (slips as he calls them) - Dau0d town comment and the slip when talking about Alsn's fOS 3) Wanting me to "Take care of Rad" day 1
The Day 1 lynch
First, I want to point out his indecisiveness and apparent apathy to who he wanted lynched.
Djo's first actual pursuit was Inig. He was pressing on Inig pretty well. However, when asked who he would want to lynch, he says Sylver (with his vote on Inig)
On October 27 2012 00:51 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 00:42 kushm4sta wrote: More on daoud: He seems much more careful about what he says this game than last game. Last games his posts were like WTF is this weird guy talking about. This game they look like he doesn't want to catch anyone's attention.
Why we shouldn't lynch djodref today: He does look pretty scummy. But I don't see how anyone can have a lot of certainty in that read. Combination of high activity and low certainty means he should not lynch him. Also realize that djodref is in a position where he NEEDS to evolve his meta whether he is town or scum. His first game he played as a noob, understandable because it was his first game. His second game, he pretended to be a noob as a scum strat. I think showing that he is better than the newb he pretended to be last game would be the natural play for town djodref, and also scum djodref trying to appear as town djodref.
Djo: who out of the active players seems scummiest to you? Also why did you bring up how you want to lynch a lurker without even trying to pressure your scumreads? @KushDebears and Rad are looking quite ok. I'm leaning town for both of them. I'm waiting for Cheese to post what he has to say about me because I'm still null on him. I didn't like some posts from sylver but he had some nice reactions during our latest fight. I need some time to look at dandel. I didn't like the way he voted Inig, but he said he was not sure even. I would say sylver right now... But I've been spending too much time defending myself. I need to calm down and re-read some filters for a while.
A couple of posts later, he unvotes and states why he doesn't want to lynch Inig suddenly.
On October 27 2012 01:03 Djodref wrote: Regarding an Inig's lynch, I'm not comfortable with it...
In my opinion, he had a positive response after my case against him. I doubt that he could be a scum after that. His role claim was looking really sincere. If he can improve his presence in the thread and his scumhunting, I don't want to lynch him. I'm going to unvote him. I would cast my vote on Roco or imcasey if they magically reappear. I'll wake up early tomorrow to see if the bandwagon is still against me or not.
If you are town, do not sheep and cast your vote against me. Read my filter and make your own opinion by yourself. You are going to feel some heat if you cast your vote too lightly because I'm going to flip green.
I'm sorry but I need some sleep guys
## Unvote
That's quite the turnaround after the pressure and vote
On October 27 2012 08:20 Djodref wrote: @debears
No, I'm not comfortable with any of the lynches to be honest. I'm looking at their filter over and over again and try to find some little clues... Regarding Inig, I should vote him if I was only a rational machine (no scumhunting at the beginning, wishy washy on Cheese, voting imcasey unexpectedly, the slip you have found, etc...) but I feel him as sincere in his posts.a
Not sure why he claimed though.
Regarding daoud, I have no reasons to vote for him at the exception of his hasty vote.
His only reason for not voting Inig was that Inig seemed "sincere". In fact, he said that it would be rational to lynch Inig based on his posting. That one post is a huge contradiction. Notice how during his time, he puts suspicion on Sylver.
Also, notice the timing of the unvote. He unvoted when there were other people agreeing with his case. That's really weird combined with the "he's sincere" reasoning on Inig.
Djo's approach on Dau0d
Despite Djo's suspicions on Inig and Sylver, he ends up voting Dau0d. Why? Lets see
On October 27 2012 08:56 Djodref wrote: ## Vote daoud
Because his involvement in this game has not been great so far...
Not the greatest reasoning. He does provide some reasoning right after though.
On October 27 2012 08:56 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 08:46 debears wrote: Bad word choice on my part. Bad = weak in my post.
And the same points on inig and dauod. 1) semi lurker 2) town reads/ percent town reads 3) generally blending in
Give me Allow me to ameliorate for you, sir. 1.) Inig was a semi lurker to begin with. As of late, he has been posting more and with greater content. Da0ud, on the other hand, has contributed much less and is still lurking. 2.) Let's look at both of their percentage town reads. Inigs:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 16:17 Inigmaticalism wrote: I would label Djo as like 70% town. Hes been consistent and contributing. I think hes gone after me too long to be mafia. He has talked an awful lot though. Its probably more likely, with all his questions and style of scumhunting, thats hes a vigi or SK or something like that, seeing who he can get lynched (who he thinks is scum if hes vigi, etc), and then who he cant hes found his night targets. Just a thought.
Da0ud's:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 22:41 da0ud wrote: Talking about smileyDjo he has put a lot of pressure on people. Asking open questions etc. For having played a game with him where he played to nice lovable newbie card, I believe he is trying to step up and actually be a leader for town. I put him 90% town.
Inig has more reason for considering Djo town, and puts it at 70% (leaning town). He says he's been consistent, obviously posting alot, and going after him of all people. He likes this, and even offers some counter-roles that he could be instead of mafia. Da0ud on the other hand only says "hey, he's asking questions, must be 90% (almost definitely town)" I find Da0uds reasons for thinking Djo town less plausible than Inigs, and he almost considers him town. 3.) Inig has been more distinguished in asking questions / contributing. His theory on Dandel is intriguing and unique, and something I may want to follow up on in the future. His vote of imcasey and Dandel is anything BUT blending in.
Notice his reasoning. It's literally almost the same for Inig. Yet, he feels that Inig was "more distinguished in asking questions/contributing". I don't get it. Also, he didn't think Dau0d's meta was different than Dau0d's town game when he posted this earlier.
On October 27 2012 00:53 Djodref wrote: Regarding daoud, I don't want to lynch him because he has reacted quite fast and naturally to my slip. Him posting some nonsense about the possibility of a SK just after totally fits his meta.
He needs to post a lot more though...
He flip-flopped onto Dau0d after kush's case while spreading suspicion onto 2 other plays (slyverfyre and Inig). His reasoning for moving his suspicion around was poor at the best. To me, it seems like he didn't care who got lynched
Hammering CheeseCake for the Switched Vote
This was posted after the lynch
On October 27 2012 17:53 Djodref wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 08:20 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Okay I just got back, and will be here pre and post lynch.
My thoughts on the current state of affairs. It seems the lynch is in favor of Inig, but Da0ud following close behind. My vote on Djo is obviously not doing any good. I still consider him suspicious, and he is by no means off the hook. My efforts right now are better spent deciding who is a better lynch candidate: Da0ud or Inig.
/snip
@ CheeseAt this point, were you considering that daoud and Inig were better candidate than me ? You have been suspecting me for quite a long time D1 and you suddenly prefer to lynch daoud because some replacement came in and told you he was scummy ? You alsmost didn't consider him at all until that point yet you have no problem with lynching him instead of your top scumread (which was me) ? I'm pretty surprised that you didn't try to push my lynch.
Isn't this similar to what Djo did? Yet Djo is calling him out for it? Djo had no considerations of Dau0d until the kush case was posted.
On October 27 2012 23:19 Djodref wrote:"That being said, you were my best scum read at the time; but there was no chance of you being lynched." @ CheeseHere is a quote from you. Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 12:50 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: /snip The constant asking for info on Ingi / diverting attention, his useless "are you mafia?" question that I pointed out earlier, the inability to adequately answer some of the accusations/questions thrown at him. It doesn't add up. Actually, it does add up. I'm thinking he's scum. I've had a FoS on you for quite some time now, Djodref. Time to upgrade it.
##Vote: Djodref As you can see, I was a little more than your best scumread. Nevertheless, you gave little to no protest about lynching daoud or ini over me. Big scumtell in my book. Have a look at debears reactions when people started to vote daoud. He was trying to push his case until the end.This commitment is a big towntell. Where was your reaction when you came back to thhe tread and realized that a lynch on me was "not possible" ? No protest, no comments about other people being stupid or whatever, not trying to push my lynch. And you proceeding to compare the percentage daoud and Ini were giving for their townread on me to decide who to lynch between the two... do you have any comments to do on this ? FoS Cheese
Yet again, a FOS for hypocritical reasoning. Not only did Djo drop his top scumread for poor reasoning, he voted for Dau0d for poor reasoning. And now he's spreading suspicion on CheeseCake.
This post, however, is the kicker
On October 27 2012 08:00 Djodref wrote: @ Cheese
What the fuck are you doing with your vote still on my back ? Come in the thread and choose who you want to lynch today between daoud and Ini. Tell us your reasons about it !
Djo told him to change his vote in the first place!!!!!!!!!! Then, he tries to accuse Cheese of scum since Cheese did it???? Wow.
Meta
Djo has little meta to go on with only 2 games. However, there are differences from his town game and scum game. These differences, related to this game, are not damning by any means, but do support that Djo could be scum.
1) Djo is capable of being active as scum. His filter was roughly 9 pgs as scum in Looney
2)His case format this game compared to his other games
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=372945¤tpage=58#1147 - Game as scum http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=23#441 - this game
Look at the shocking similarities. Now, this could be how he likes to post now, since this is only his 3rd game.
However, in looking at his first newbie as cop, no posts have the same format (Correct me if I'm wrong on this Djo)
3) Personality - Djo's personality this game is similar to his other games as cop and mafia. Take out the newbie card play, and he sounds the same in all 3. Thus, his personality is a null tell, but it mean that he can be mafia
A Common Fallacy
I think this game has fallen into the trap of activity = town. That is not always the case. Take a long hard look at Djo's filter and this case. His filter is huge and it was a bitch to go through. Mafia can hide in a big filter.
Djo is my number 2 scum read besides Dandel right now. I still need to see if Dandel even comes back (and defends himself properly + has something to contribute) before I would think of voting Djo.
Let me know if you need clarification on anything. Reading Djo's filter + writing out the case = sucks
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omg i did it tooo...fuck me sideways
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