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On April 04 2012 14:02 syllogism wrote: No, that is correct because that is me saying you are a bad, bad toy.
Just as I knew, the moment I saw the daypost I knew you would just start trying to convince everyone I am scum, because that's all you can do. You're basically out, and now you're just trying to get 1 more townie down before you die, simple as that. Scared of me getting the item, or scared of me going to the lethal area?
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On April 04 2012 14:01 syllogism wrote: Do not push scumphiro to the item. Why would he even suggest that as town? He gives a very weak explanation for not being afraid of the nullify power or any other power that could possibly kill him. He isn't afraid because he knows there is nothing to be afraid of.
Who said I am not afraid of the possibility I might die? At the moment after weighing all the possibilities, the reward is far greater than the risk.
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On April 04 2012 14:06 syllogism wrote: This is such a stupid post
You're too predictable syllo. All game long you've been just laughing whenever someone points fingers at you, and telling how bad players that don't push for your scum agenda are. I'm sorry, but you're not going to be able to discredit me with your "He is bad/stupid" -posts, all you're doing is making yourself more confirmed scum in the eyes of others for being so ignorant.
You haven't done anything useful for town this game, and people can see that.
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On April 04 2012 14:09 syllogism wrote: That's not me discrediting you, the post was painful regardless of your alignment
But you still felt the need to point it out, even if it was obviously such a horrible post? I'm not going to bother spamming the thread by replying to your nonsense. You're just cluttering up the thread. Everyone should see by now that you haven't done anything to actively help the town.
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Hm, I was hoping the item was closer to the edge, but nothing a push or two can't fix.
I am volunteering to be pushed all the way to spot 24.
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EBWOP: I also do not request to be pulled out of the lethal queues.
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If I provide my full role and plan, then it is very likely to backfire. However, if we have enough townies to co-ordinate to do it swiftly, then I will do that if that's an absolute must. It's for the best of town if I do not, and I would claim right after.
Also syllo, why are you so keen to find out? Afraid you can't stop me? Well I'm not gonna let you in on it, just read again what I said. The reward is worth the risk.
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If you decide to go with the plan to push me, I suggest getting me all the way to 24, or AT LEAST 23.
If I would have to pick which to pull out of Tobon/Bluelightz, I'd go for Blue. But I feel there are players that are scummier that should be pulled instead.
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On April 04 2012 14:33 prplhz wrote: Okay why is nobody talking about confirmed scum Bluelightz? I say we all pull him.
I'm not opposed to killing Tobon either but I don't think he's as safe as Bluelightz and syllogism.
Of syllogism and Cephiro I'm up for killing syllogism first. I don't like the weird Cephiro-item plan, similar plan went horribly wrong yesterday and we don't know what other powers that scum might have. Lets just pull Bluelightz and push syllogism.
Other than that, I think that the lights-out scum ability was not only to cause chaos in conjunction with Bluelightz role (I imagine we could see the potentially booby trapped positions if there were lights?), but also to make risk.nuke's DT ability useless for today. I still believe in risk.nuke's role claim.
How is Bluelightz confirmed scum? Also, a push for me is a push for syllogism.
Best-case scenario in my plan: I get two Evil Toys killed. Worst-case scenario in my plan: I die, flip town, and give you a confirmed scum in syllogism.
How do you like the odds of that?
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Ahh, I see, thanks for pointing that out. Especial thanks for pointing out yet another contradiction of prplhz. "I really doubt that Bluelightz is scum" --> "Why is nobody talking about confirmed scum Bluelightz?"
And then his buddying on me. Is there any more confirmation I could ask for?
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On April 04 2012 14:39 Snarfs wrote: This sounds like fearmongering. Trying to convince us it's not worth our pulls to kill you rather than convincing us you're not scum. This is a scum tactic. Please don't use it if you're town.
Fairly sure he means it in a pro-town way, as Nemesis pushed him a whole 3 spots upwards (which could be much more due to stacking.) That means he'd be much easier killed by feeding him to the flames, I am fairly sure his suggestion of how to kill him if you decide to do so is pro-town.
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On April 04 2012 14:40 prplhz wrote:If Cephiro is really up for it (I'm not really as worried about losing him as I was about losing Palmar because he's really just a tunneling bastard , then we could push him TO the item, then he could do his thing (I imagine it's some kind of place swapper?) and kill syllogism. Then we could use the rest of our pushes on Tobon and our pulls on Bluelightz. If anything is leftover, we do our best to kill Mr. Wiggles. How about that?
@Cephiro Bluelightz is confirmed scum because he used his ability when it's a scum favored ability and he was told so in the thread by me and by layabout. He absolutely has to die. The only reason to push you to kill syllogism instead of pushing syllogism to kill syllogism is that you will get the item. I don't like the plan though because in case scum has some hidden ability, like another nullified or something similar they can mess with us, maybe especially so now that the lights are out. I want to kill syllogism and I'd rather push syllogism. The item isn't worth it like it wasn't worth it yesterday. I don't want to end up in a similar situation because we want some item.
Yeah, of course you're not worried about losing me, you'd just be delighted if that happened, one less person that knows you are scum. If you check my posting, you can clearly see I do not tunnel, but I have my reasons to believe and know that you & syllo are both scum. Why would I let you off the hook for something I know?
PS: Your imagination couldn't be more wrong. But I shall reveal no more details, although I am fairly sure you aren't able to stop me.
Why do you rather push me to kill syllo, just for the item? When in your opinion it's not worth it. Also as I said before, I do not need to be rescued.
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On April 04 2012 14:54 Snarfs wrote: Cephiro, do you actually know something here? You use that word a lot.
I know that syllogism is Evil. I am as certain as I can be that prplhz is Evil also. (But I cannot back this up to a modconfirmed extent yet.)
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On April 04 2012 14:55 prplhz wrote: Cephiro, yes, you are tunneling. I don't really care if you're tunneling town (me) or scum (syllogism), it's still annoying for town and I'm not really worried about scum using a power to get you killed.
1. If you read my filter, you can see I am "tunneling" on cascades and Mattchew as well. I am sorry, I must have misunderstood what tunnelling means, all this time I've been thinking it is senseless accusing of one certain person only. Care to clarify this for me?
2. If you are town, why would you NOT CARE if someone is tunneling in your opinion, as it can be harmful for town? If you think I am town, why are you not worried about scum using a power to kill me?
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I am not claiming any power yet, nor am I going to claim that anyone is modconfirmed anything, except the fact that the so far dead townies are modconfirmed.
I stand by my word though, I know syllogism is scum.
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So, you up for initiating the plan to push me towards the incineration zone while waiting for others to arrive?
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23 is enough. And even though there is plenty of time in the day, my clock is ticking. I would appriciate the sooner we get things done, but I do understand that you may want more time.
Just don't roll your thumbs around for too long is all I ask.
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Going to filter quotes to try and reduce the wall of text that is going to happen.
My 5 scumreads: syllogism, prplhz, cascades, Acrofales, Mattchew
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 16:35 Acrofales wrote: Good morning. Had a quick glance through the thread and I am quite opposed to Cephiro's plan. I just don't trust the guy. If we believe risk.nuke's claim (and I still do) that means either Cephiro or Syllo is scum. Atm I'm leaning slightly to Syllo, but just plain statistics say we shouldn't bet on Cephiro. Pretty much everybody else has better chances of not being scum, so until Syllo is dead and confirmed red, I am not cooperating with anything Cephiro proposes.
Gonna read the rest of the thread now. I understand it's dark (and full of terrors). I can obviously get behind the bluelightz pulling. I have to get to work, but when I get there I'll read the thread more carefully and decide what to do (probably pull bluelightz).
God you are flip-flopping fast. Do you want to know why I find this hilarious? Out of everyone in the game, only the ones that are in the 5 people i suspect to be scum have gone out and made a case on me. Are you actually that afraid of me, or are you trying to make me look bad by trying to make me look like I'm just OMGUSing?
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 16:53 Acrofales wrote: Let me phrase that a bit better: we have to take into account the very real possibility that Cephiro is scum.
If he's scum and we send him up there he gets: 1. An item 2. To activate whatever dastardly ability he has that requires him to be in the incineration zone (if I let my imagination run wild I can think of quite a few rather nasty ones, such as increase the size of the incineration zone). Because it's dark, we won't even know what he's doing until it's too late.
If he's town and we send him up there we get: 1. An item 2. To fulfill his masterplan of which we do not even know the rewards. Cephiro said that it helps town and probably gets Syllo killed.
While I like the town rewards and could probably get behind a Syllo kill, the rewards for scum are unknown, but probably better. Given the, lets say 40% chance that Cephiro is scum, the risk is just way too high.
As said earlier, my plan is way in favour of town. The worst case scenario for town is that I die before we get to use the item, and my death will confirm syllo as scum, so 1:1 trade.
Best case scenario, I survive and deliver you 2 scum kills. Or are you actually proposing that after seeing a nullify ability & darkness ability, that I could be some some sort of godlike superscum and get half the town killed by going into the incineration zone? A sacrifical mechanic would be far more likely than that.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 16:56 Acrofales wrote: So, Cephiro: will your plan have any other benefits than killing Syllo (which we really don't need your masterplan for) and getting you the item (which I don't really want to do at this point)?
Read what I said, I did actually bring this up earlier as well but you clearly chose to ignore it.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 19:09 Dirkzor wrote: I think Cephiro's plan suck. Any plan we made yesterday was fucked and it will be the same today. (and the item is not even in the equation as the item suck. Its like a shiny objects that people really can't wait to dig up but it always turn out just be the opener from a soda can.)
I would like people to push Syllo. The fact that scum killed Palmar/Sbrubbles (or one of them) and not syllo is disturbing. Palmar had done shit all so killing him over Syllo makes no sense. I'm assuming Sbrubbles was a town hit becase the only reason I see scum killing Sbrubbles is if Syllo is indeed town. Risk's claim was/i believable even when poorly executed by him.
Mattchew is just a oneliner machine who follows whatever crazy plan anyone cooks up to appear to be helping town.
If you haven't read, you will not need to save me out of the incineration area, which means you will be able to use your pulls to insta-kill someone by pulling them all the way down. Why would you push syllo, when you can push me and achieve the same? Or would you rather see syllo have the item? I can understand if you wanted to pull him, by pushing him especially after I've told my plan is just.... retarded. Also, agreed on Mattchew.
For the love of god though, please read syllogism's filter and show me that he's been even trying to scumhunt. He hasn't done anything valuable for the town yet.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 19:32 Acrofales wrote:Okay, I have read through the thread. The day lasts 48 hours. Why all the rush with pulling Bluelightz? I thought we agreed after yesterday to not spend our PoPs so hastily? I think Bluelightz is almost certainly scum, but I am far more interested in getting the whole Syllo/Cephiro/risk.nuke mess sorted out. Can we wait with the bluelightz pulls until we've figured out a plan for that? I'm still waiting for Cephiro to come up with a better explanation of why his plan benefits town (and as I explain below I am now actually very suspicious of him). Instead of his plan, I propose both Cephiro and Syllo get pulled off the bottom just to be sure. A 1:1 trade is generally good for town and the only chance it's not a 1:1 trade is if risk.nuke was lying, in which case he gets lynched tomorrow. I have gone over Syllo and Cephiro's filter with a comb. Lets start with Cephiro: I find his assertions of why his plan is townie increasingly scummy the more I look at them. He has a LOT of filler asserting that he's town and we should listen to him. Do I need to refer to the OP of jubjub mafia about why this is completely pointless posting? You can't prove your town by asserting it and the increased repetition is just making me suspicious: who are you trying to convince with this? You get in a bitch fight with Syllo, which serves NOBODY. We are all almost certain that one, or both of you are scum and you two squabbling over it is completely useless and just clogs up the thread. On to his reason for not revealing any details of the plan: Show nested quote +On April 04 2012 14:24 Cephiro wrote: If I provide my full role and plan, then it is very likely to backfire. However, if we have enough townies to co-ordinate to do it swiftly, then I will do that if that's an absolute must. It's for the best of town if I do not, and I would claim right after.
Okay, nobody wants the details of HOW it works, just WHAT it does and why that benefits more than just pushing Syllo (or actually, both of you) off the cliff. Your reluctance to say anything other than "it benefits town and will get Syllo dead" is not making me like your plan at all. Next, I don't understand how he is not afraid of the nullify thingy that got Palmar stuck up there and his explanation of why not seems extremely dubious: Show nested quote +On April 04 2012 13:41 Cephiro wrote: Also, what do you others think about the nullify abillity? I have my reasons to believe it is very limited, at most 2-shot, most likely oneshot. If anyone can tell something about queue positions, you should come forth with the information as well, as I cannot see town getting hurt more than having a benefit of it. Pray tell us your "reasons to believe", oh enlightened one! Is it because it's a scum ability and this is a scumslip? He also seems in an incredible rush to get this to happen before people have time to think it through. In fact, the one redeeming quality is that, if he's scum, I would've expected other mafia to get this bandwagon going, but that's too much wifom for me. On to Syllo: yesterday I thought Sbrubbles was more likely to be scum than Syllo, but things have changed. Taken without what seems to be a serious scumslip by Cephiro, I would almost certainly label Syllo scum now that Sbrubbles flipped town. If we ignore, as he asks us to, his timing on the D1 PoPs, he has contributed a grand total of nothing to this thread. Some speculation on BM's roleclaim is the grand total of his scumhunting. Everything else is filler: he shows presence without actually doing anything useful. He has a somewhat useful dialogue with WBG, but it is only about why he isn't scum, no real contribution at all. Additionally, the same accusation of a giant bitchfight with Cephiro can be leveled at him: useless filler to pad his filter. My opinion: we pull both of them off the cliff to ensure no mistakes. A 1:1 trade is good for town and, given their postings, we might even have two mafia here.
First, the point about me somewhat constantly saying I am town. I don't see what's wrong with that. I know I am town and I have no reason to hide it either. Would you rather have me type in conditional every single time? There is no point for me to speculate that I could be scum in every message of mine as I know I am town, and you know it too. So you don't want a roleclaim but you still want to know what my ability does? Well, I'll make it simple for you. It gets scum killed.
You also blame me for cluttering the thread up with syllo. Sure, that may be slightly true, but if that's the only way I'm going to convince you guys of getting syllo killed, then so be it. I'm here to kill scum, not to play diplomatics.
Also I found it hilarious how you use the same arguments on me as syllogism did. You both keep pointing out how I am not afraid of being nullified, and trying to find out why. Why would you try to find out the reason unless you were scum trying to stop me? You couldn't be much more obvious. Especially since you all use the same poor arguments on me.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 20:15 syllogism wrote: It doesn't seem possible to even kill ceph today as assuming the nullifying power can be used more than once, scum will just nullify him after we've wasted PoPs on him. Even if they can't do that, he may not be lying about having some sort of power that allows him to switch places in the queue.
Look at this gem of a post by syllogism. His only post when he checks the thread is about trying to place suspicion on me. I repeat, he has not and is clearly not going to do anything useful for the town. Is it that hard for you all to see that he hasn't been scumhunting at all?
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 20:16 cascades wrote: Cephiro you complain about Syllo speculating about mafia powers that might need pop to activate, then you go ahead and speculate that its unlikely there's no mafia framer?
More importantly, you also softclaim that implies syllo is mod confirmed red. You backed out of it after people called you out, since you still need to have powers to get yourself out of incineration somehow. Doesn't excuse the scummy softclaim.
I am really curious about the plan now. I want to hear it. You have to justify better before we help you. There's a chance you scum in our eyes.
You've heard the plan and all there is to it. Do you have a reason to believe there is a mafia framer then? Also, you claim that I complained about syllo's speculation about scum powers that may need PoP to activate. This is false however, as I was only asking him questions to specify what he means. Why are you trying to make it look bad for me?
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 22:20 prplhz wrote:No one is disputing your claim, no one ever did. If you read the OP you'd see that everybody in this game has a role, it's in game mechanic 10; everybody is going to flip "blue" (or green as people actually just flip). You were told repeatedly not to use an ability because it was scum favored and then you go ahead and do it anyway. If you're town this is by far the worst performance I have ever seen from a townie. I'm getting a feeling that you're actually town, you're just not reading the thread, and relying solely on having an ability to confirm that you're town, but none of this matters. After what you did, town has to kill you. Let me restate the very clear case on Bluelightz: - Bluelightz has an ability where he can booby trap random places on the board. This is clearly a scum favored ability, though that has nothing to do with the case on him since role has nothing to do with alignment. Yesterday, I explained to him why it is a scum favored ability and told him not to use it and additionally layabout made it very clear that if Bluelightz used it then Bluelightz died.
- Bluelightz used his ability.
It's that simple. Everybody pull Bluelightz off this board right now.
Prp wants to get bluelightz killed even though he thinks that he may very well be town. I do not see why a townie would want to kill another townie, unless it would confirm a scum. However, if bluelightz flips town, it will not give us much of a clue towards who is scum.
I'm also starting to get annoyed by how everyone claims Bluelightz ability to be scum favoured. Sure, under the circumstances it might be (due to the darkness ability being used), but a skilled town in normal circumstances should easily be able to use it in their favour.
I am in no way defending bluelightz however. In my opinion his play so far has been quite lackluster, and isn't contributing the town enough. But there are many others that are so obvious scum that I see no reason to kill bluelightz over them.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 04 2012 23:05 Acrofales wrote: In addition to being like 90% certainly scum, you have a problem reading conditionals? I state both possible cases. You're either scum, or a townie who might as well be scum for all the help you're giving them. Brb, I'm grabbing my pitchfork (although a torch would be more appropriate, given the circumstances).
While I'm at it, if you are serious about the positions of your bombs, might I point out that position 24 is a COMPLETELY USELESS place to put a bomb, regardless of alignment? Anybody who is on position 24 at the end of the day gets incinerated. All you achieve is that now they (maybe) get blown up, in addition to getting incinerated. Whoop-de-doop. Didn't you say your ability was intended to cost us LESS PoPs to kill people?
Acrofales casting further suspicion on Bluelightz, as if he finds the need to ensure that Blue dies tonight. I would like to point out that anyone that actually concentrates on reading the thread would know that Blue doesn't pick those three positions but are randomly chosen by the mods. Acrofales seems to be content with ignoring this fact and blaming Bluelightz for it.
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On April 05 2012 01:27 wherebugsgo wrote: I am illiterate and retarded.
Thank you Cephiro.
You're welcome.
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EBWOP: I'd also like to point out that if we decide to not use my plan today, it is very likely that the mafia will kill me at night (or get me killed by the flames or pushing me over the edge.) I can clearly see that scum is scared about my powers, and they sure have a reason to. The clock is ticking. Decisions please.
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