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-_-, I have already made it clear that I'm willing to lynch you to avoid just that. Stop badgering me because your frustrated.
I still think k2hd is the better lynch.
On March 02 2012 06:23 Chocolate wrote: Final point for now is that I'm starting to find it a bit odd that DoYouHas has been agreeing with nearly every thing I said. Maybe trying to buddy me?
Chocolate, could you please give me examples. I didn't notice I was doing this.
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You are right that I have been soft defending you. I didn't want to lynch you. The only real example here that might be suspicious is the 2 cases on NightFury. You posted your case when I was still working on mine. I didn't see it until I posted. Everything else I have been calling bad argumentation as I see it.
As for voting nttea. I agreed with you. I put my vote on him because I think you vote the person most likely to be scum. Right now that is nttea.
I still read what you posts critically Chocolate, and I definitely am not trying to buddy you.
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As for why nobody is posting, that is obvious. The people on gumshoe have already won. Both Chocolate and I have admitted that we will move over to gumshoe if that becomes necessary. So they have no incentive to move over to k2hd. gumshoe is practically a lock for today's lynch. That is why I started this back and forth between us Chocolate. There is nothing left to talk about in reference to our lynch, so I'm moving on.
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Alderan posted his speculation because I asked him to, Hyde. That entire section equally applies to me.
I think that there are similarities to how our day1 played out and how day1 played out in SNMM7. I think that that it is a pretty decent place to start thinking about how the scum are playing this game. Is it speculation? of course. But it was helpful when I was deciding how I was going to filter the game looking for scum. I wanted to know if Alderan agreed with me (he did), and I wanted to get his perspective.
You are not wrong posting that posting this kind of speculation is largely unhelpful to the game as a whole. However, it does worry me that you completely ignored my involvement in something you consider so questionable.
And I'm going to preempt those of you who are going to come down on me for soft/chainsaw defending Chocolate and Alderan. That is not my intent even if that is the result. It's not a big distinction, but a true one.
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I do not think that scum are copying the play of SNMM7, just like I don't think our day1 was a copy of SNMM7. I think they are similar. Is it such a stretch to think that a similar day1 could mean similar day1 scum play? I don't think so. And why did I post these thoughts? for transparency. I wanted the thread to know where I was coming from and what I was looking at when I made my cases. The reason I agree that it is largely unhelpful for the thread is because of the people who did not play/observe SNMM7 are largely left out, not because it is pointless speculation.
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I tried to give them a better target than you gum, gg.
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Let's not waste this night. If you have any things you have noted about people's play that you want to ask them about, I suggest we use this night time for that. Save scumlists and hard suspicions for tomorrow when they can't be used against us with the mafia hit.
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First and foremost comes the lynching of nttea. He lurks all game, drops a vote in the voting thread without saying anything in this thread. And just happens to vote for a townie. There is no backing your way out of that. He is gone tomorrow.
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On March 02 2012 23:29 nttea wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2012 16:20 DoYouHas wrote: First and foremost comes the lynching of nttea. He lurks all game, drops a vote in the voting thread without saying anything in this thread. And just happens to vote for a townie. There is no backing your way out of that. He is gone tomorrow. wait what townie did i vote on?! also spent what feels like an eternity sifting through posts and im just lost at this shit... if there is something good there im not the guy that will find it, plenty of time before next lynch though regarding the accusations against me I'll just plead insanity, and please keep looking for others even if you think im scum there's still 3 more to find. Weak shit i know im sorry but it's also still true.
I thought you voted for gumshoe, sorry.
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This will be the scummiest thing I say all game.
I don't care what nttea's alignment is, I don't care how well intentioned he sounds right now. He lurked for an entire day, after replacing a modkill, and then ninja voted. That means he gets lynched, period. I will not suffer that kind of play in any game I am in. The is the one instance where I will policy lynch the hell out of anyone.
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On March 03 2012 01:00 zelblade wrote:Goddamm, wasnt expecting that flip. Thought that he was most definately scum.. guess I was wrong.
I have a couple of suspisions. My primary one is actually that DoYouHas is scum. Firstly, I have already stated I am really suspicious of the way he dealt with Alderan on day 1. Despite thinking that Steve is the better lynch, he decides to leave his vote on igabod, stating that he does not trust Alderan, primarly because he got "burned" by Ald last game. This logic is clearly bullshit. He, at this point, has no reason to suspect Alderan - besides knowing that Alderan's scum play is good. At first, I thought that this might have been fear of Ald's scum play - and he instictively worried about that possibility. However, thinking further, I believe that a townie DYH would have made a case during the day, and pushed it hard, if he indeed did feel Alderan was scum. However, he did no such thing, instead waiting for night and letting a no-lynch happen. 1. Another thing that makes me suspicious is his stance on igabod. He states this on igabod: Show nested quote +We don't know igabod is getting modkilled. There is every chance that he will be replaced. Because of this I still think that he is our best lynch option. Why would he think this? For one, it is more often than not a townie which goes inactive and has to be replaced, and Im sure that DYH knows this. Yet, he still feels that igabod will be the best lynch, simply because he will be replaced. It makes no sense, and I think phagga sums it up nicely here. Show nested quote +This argumentation is absolutely stupid. If igabod is getting replaced, then he was not playing the game at all. Therefore him lurking does not say anything at all about his alignement. He might even be a blue for all we know, and some real life matter keep him from playing. 2. His case on Alderan rang more alarm bells for me. A large portion of it lies on how Aldrean has been attempting to "buddy" him, which I feel is complete bullshit. Again, this seemed (at first) to be him subconciously being afraid of Ald's scum play, but in reality, I believe that he is more likely to be fearmongering here. 3. Hyde also gives a good explanation why DYH's venture into the speculation of scums actions in day 1 in SNMMIV to aglin with scum's motives this game. I see no parallel at all between these two games, and I believe that DYH should be able to see this. This is most likely an attempt to derail the topic at hand, and indulge town in a useless topic for quite a while. Thankfully it didnt succeed though. Gumshoe's lynch is another area for suspision. Although he was on the "right" side of the lynch, I believe that it is a null tell, and may even be an indication of scum, considering the number of votes that were on gumshoe. 3.1 The reason for this is that scum will want to split up their votes, and it is rather likely that he is doing what Alderan did with DYH's own lynch last game - claiming that he didnt think gumshoe was scum and getting some towncred for the lynch. 4. Besides this, he is also really wishy washy about gumshoe. He states that he believes he is town based on his similar posting style - something which I feel is completely different (but that might be personal opinion, so w/e), but instead does not push against the lynch hard, citing that gumshoe might in fact be scum using his town meta as a cover. That is a bloody weak reason and we know it, and it is never enough for one to doubt one's innocence based on that and that alone. I would expect a townie in that sort of situation (thinking that a townie was to be lynched) to push against the lynch hard, and not apply some soft defense that wont stick. It seems that he wants the lynch to go through - yet doesnt want to be lynched for it. 5. Honestly, I could go on, as I feel that DYH's logic this game is really off. I believe that he is good, and should know better, which is also why I believe that he is scum.
1. I thought igabod was the best lynch because he was a lurker. When the choice was between what I thought was a bad lynch and a lurker. I chose the lurker. The point that he is going to be replaced simply means that he won't be dealt with with a modkill. Later I admitted that objectively Steveling was the better lynch. However, this is not an objective game. My fears that Alderan was trying to pull a vote switch made me dig in my heels and refuse to vote for someone of his choice.
2. My case against Alderan was never meant to push him for a lynch, it was to fish for more content from him. When he played scum he posted a case on Dimmuklok, and managed to avoid chiming in on most other things. So I drew a response and a number of opinions out of him. That was the point.
3. No parallels between this game and SNMM7? Really? Both had a person do something crazy early on, and was largely trusted as a townie because of it. Both had a lack of strong cases day1. Both have the more experienced players at eachother's throats. Both had 2 candidates with a number of votes on them without a majority towards the end of the day. Both threatened a no-lynch and had a 3rd candidate come up as a compromise. That is what I see, why don't you? 3.1 So you see no parallels between this game and SNMM7, but you agree with me and Alderan that scum likely split their vote (which is a parallel), AND you think that I am playing scum similarly to Alderan from SNMM7 (another parallel). SO, let me get this straight. You think that I am scum, that I gave an accurate portrayal of how scum are playing this game, made a point of bringing it back up and getting Alderan to comment on it, and that I wasted everyone's time with speculations that you seem to agree with and even use in your case against me. That is what is absurd.
4. I was wishy-washy about gumshoe, that is how I felt about him. I found things in his play that I did not like, but I also saw things that seemed pro-town. That is why I tried to convince people to lynch k2hd. I felt he was the better lynch. I have no strong defense for this accusation, wishy-washy is accurate. I had no strong read on gumshoe.
5. I do think I'm better than some, but my cases were never rock solid in NMM3, I just had more conviction. My scumhunting was remarkably poor in SNMM7. You want to use the meta that I'm better than this against me? You are wrong, I'm floundering in an unproductive town just as much as everyone else.
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On March 03 2012 03:25 slOosh wrote:DYH:Before D2 I've been on the fence with DYH as on one side it does look like he is trying to contribute and drive discussion, but on the other he is flip flopping a lot and seems really unsure of his reads. I understand your desire to lynch the hard lurker - but I really don't want N2 and D3 to be dominated by discussion of the validity of policy lynches. My questions for you still remain: Show nested quote + Did you think that k2hd was a better choice solely based on comparison to gumshoe? Do you still think that he is a good lynch suspect for tomorrow?
We need as much info as we can get and we can pick up discussion on nttea lynch if you still feel inclined to do during D3, but it doesn't make sense to do it now at night since you could die and mafia might WIFOM stuff up if your reads and stances aren't clear.
No I didn't think k2hd was a better choice solely based on comparison to gumshoe. He was someone that I found suspicious when I was making my case against NightFury because he met many of the scum standards I was using to accuse NightFury. I do think he is a good suspect for tomorrow.
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On February 25 2012 04:12 DoYouHas wrote: /in
I will have a probable schedule conflict with this game. I will be out of town and out of touch for the weekend of March 2-4.
This is your reminder. I will be leaving in ~3hours and I will be gone for ~50 hours. I cleared this with dreamflower before the game started, and I apologize. I hope to be back before day3 ends, but there is no guarantee of that.
I will be around for the 3 hours, but I will be busy packing and such. Don't expect long responses.
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On March 03 2012 06:58 ghost_403 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2012 02:58 DoYouHas wrote: This will be the scummiest thing I say all game.
I don't care what nttea's alignment is, I don't care how well intentioned he sounds right now. He lurked for an entire day, after replacing a modkill, and then ninja voted. That means he gets lynched, period. I will not suffer that kind of play in any game I am in. The is the one instance where I will policy lynch the hell out of anyone. I really don't like this post. At all. Punishing his behavior at the expense of the town is horrible play. (Also, saying it sounds scummy doesn't make it any less scummy.) We have no reason to believe that we have either a medic or a veteran in this game, meaning that we will almost certainly be losing a townie every night. If nttea is townie, that makes it 5 townies against 4 scum on Day 4. I don't like those odds. Of course, he could be scum, but I haven't seen anything from you or anyone else that would convince me of that. I'm not happy about the ninja vote either, but I'm afraid we might be throwing away the game with a policy lynch at this point.
You have no reason to believe that there isn't a medic or veteran in this game. Are you blue fishing?
As for nttea. I'm taking a stand. We let a lot of things slide because this is a newbie game. nttea is over the line. I won't let it slide and I won't abide that play going un-lynched in any game I am in.
nttea, this is not an attack on you personally, I want you to keep playing and learning mafia. But I will not be moved on this point.
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Good luck town, I will see you all in a couple of days!
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Just got back, I have about 4 pages to read. Getting to it.
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+ Show Spoiler +On March 03 2012 22:54 zelblade wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2012 04:03 DoYouHas wrote:On March 03 2012 01:00 zelblade wrote:Goddamm, wasnt expecting that flip. Thought that he was most definately scum.. guess I was wrong.
I have a couple of suspisions. My primary one is actually that DoYouHas is scum. Firstly, I have already stated I am really suspicious of the way he dealt with Alderan on day 1. Despite thinking that Steve is the better lynch, he decides to leave his vote on igabod, stating that he does not trust Alderan, primarly because he got "burned" by Ald last game. This logic is clearly bullshit. He, at this point, has no reason to suspect Alderan - besides knowing that Alderan's scum play is good. At first, I thought that this might have been fear of Ald's scum play - and he instictively worried about that possibility. However, thinking further, I believe that a townie DYH would have made a case during the day, and pushed it hard, if he indeed did feel Alderan was scum. However, he did no such thing, instead waiting for night and letting a no-lynch happen. 1. Another thing that makes me suspicious is his stance on igabod. He states this on igabod: We don't know igabod is getting modkilled. There is every chance that he will be replaced. Because of this I still think that he is our best lynch option. Why would he think this? For one, it is more often than not a townie which goes inactive and has to be replaced, and Im sure that DYH knows this. Yet, he still feels that igabod will be the best lynch, simply because he will be replaced. It makes no sense, and I think phagga sums it up nicely here. This argumentation is absolutely stupid. If igabod is getting replaced, then he was not playing the game at all. Therefore him lurking does not say anything at all about his alignement. He might even be a blue for all we know, and some real life matter keep him from playing. 2. His case on Alderan rang more alarm bells for me. A large portion of it lies on how Aldrean has been attempting to "buddy" him, which I feel is complete bullshit. Again, this seemed (at first) to be him subconciously being afraid of Ald's scum play, but in reality, I believe that he is more likely to be fearmongering here. 3. Hyde also gives a good explanation why DYH's venture into the speculation of scums actions in day 1 in SNMMIV to aglin with scum's motives this game. I see no parallel at all between these two games, and I believe that DYH should be able to see this. This is most likely an attempt to derail the topic at hand, and indulge town in a useless topic for quite a while. Thankfully it didnt succeed though. Gumshoe's lynch is another area for suspision. Although he was on the "right" side of the lynch, I believe that it is a null tell, and may even be an indication of scum, considering the number of votes that were on gumshoe. 3.1 The reason for this is that scum will want to split up their votes, and it is rather likely that he is doing what Alderan did with DYH's own lynch last game - claiming that he didnt think gumshoe was scum and getting some towncred for the lynch. 4. Besides this, he is also really wishy washy about gumshoe. He states that he believes he is town based on his similar posting style - something which I feel is completely different (but that might be personal opinion, so w/e), but instead does not push against the lynch hard, citing that gumshoe might in fact be scum using his town meta as a cover. That is a bloody weak reason and we know it, and it is never enough for one to doubt one's innocence based on that and that alone. I would expect a townie in that sort of situation (thinking that a townie was to be lynched) to push against the lynch hard, and not apply some soft defense that wont stick. It seems that he wants the lynch to go through - yet doesnt want to be lynched for it. 5. Honestly, I could go on, as I feel that DYH's logic this game is really off. I believe that he is good, and should know better, which is also why I believe that he is scum. 1. I thought igabod was the best lynch because he was a lurker. When the choice was between what I thought was a bad lynch and a lurker. I chose the lurker. The point that he is going to be replaced simply means that he won't be dealt with with a modkill. Later I admitted that objectively Steveling was the better lynch. However, this is not an objective game. My fears that Alderan was trying to pull a vote switch made me dig in my heels and refuse to vote for someone of his choice. 2. My case against Alderan was never meant to push him for a lynch, it was to fish for more content from him. When he played scum he posted a case on Dimmuklok, and managed to avoid chiming in on most other things. So I drew a response and a number of opinions out of him. That was the point. 3. No parallels between this game and SNMM7? Really? Both had a person do something crazy early on, and was largely trusted as a townie because of it. Both had a lack of strong cases day1. Both have the more experienced players at eachother's throats. Both had 2 candidates with a number of votes on them without a majority towards the end of the day. Both threatened a no-lynch and had a 3rd candidate come up as a compromise. That is what I see, why don't you? 3.1 So you see no parallels between this game and SNMM7, but you agree with me and Alderan that scum likely split their vote (which is a parallel), AND you think that I am playing scum similarly to Alderan from SNMM7 (another parallel). SO, let me get this straight. You think that I am scum, that I gave an accurate portrayal of how scum are playing this game, made a point of bringing it back up and getting Alderan to comment on it, and that I wasted everyone's time with speculations that you seem to agree with and even use in your case against me. That is what is absurd. 4. I was wishy-washy about gumshoe, that is how I felt about him. I found things in his play that I did not like, but I also saw things that seemed pro-town. That is why I tried to convince people to lynch k2hd. I felt he was the better lynch. I have no strong defense for this accusation, wishy-washy is accurate. I had no strong read on gumshoe. 5. I do think I'm better than some, but my cases were never rock solid in NMM3, I just had more conviction. My scumhunting was remarkably poor in SNMM7. You want to use the meta that I'm better than this against me? You are wrong, I'm floundering in an unproductive town just as much as everyone else. 1) The definition of a lurker is someone who actually posts, but doesnt post anything worthwhile. Did you really think igabod was more likely scum than town? I dont understand why you would prefer having him dead as opposed to replaced. Chances are the "lurker" is more often town than scum either way, and the fact that he has flipped town further reinforces this fact. 2) So what do you think of Alderan now? 3) Yes. Perhaps the situation played out a little similarly, but no two games are the same. Besides, what makes you believe that scum did the same thing as last game? One of the "expereinced players" could easily be scum for one, or the candidates could be scum. You have zero reason to believe that scum played similarly according to last game. Why dont you see this? 3.1) Scum almost always split their votes day 1, for obvious reasons, unless the lynch is close and one of the two candidates are mafia. There is no reason to believe they did not do so, and having all of them dump their votes on a single person is just dumb. And no, I never said that you and Alderan were acting similary. Instead, what i meant is this: I believe that you didnt vote gumshoe, claiming that you thought he was town, to gain towncred when he flipped. Alderan did something similar to this going against your lynch and voting for someone else instead. Besides, how do you know what you think is an "accurate portyal" of scum's play? You do not know how they are acting. Another thing - what conclusions have you yourself drawn from this activiy? Note how you never actually do so, and never actually use this speculation to drive home a case. Which is why I dont see it as useful.
Note that this still doesnt explain why you wanted to venture into this topic.4) Isnt this a position scum love to be in? 5) You might be right on this point that I am expecting too much of you, honestly because NMMIII gave me quite the impact. However, I still do think that your logic is horrible, and dont believe that you believe in it.
1. If you make it through a day without posting, but are not being removed from the game, that makes you a lurker.
2. I did not like his early play with 1 case and lots of smaller posts. That is why I pushed him some. Also, I don't like that he has not posted in a while. However, (this is mostly from memory because I'm in a bit of hurry) he makes more sense some of you. I lean town for him atm.
3. You don't like my reasoning, so be it. I think that correlating events and situations hint at how the mafia are playing. You don't. I'm not wasting any more time on this.
3.1 bolded What is this? It was extremely clear what you said, you said that I did something similar to Alderan's scum play from SNMM7.
As for the "accurate portrayal" talk. My actual words were, "You think that I am scum, that I gave an accurate portrayal of how scum are playing this game, made a point of bringing it back up and getting Alderan to comment on it, and that I wasted everyone's time with speculations that you seem to agree with and even use in your case against me." I never said that I thought that I had presented a completely accurate portrayal of scum play this game. Instead, my point is that you are using some of the same things that I brought up in my speculation to attack me. So you must think that I was at least somewhat accurate with my speculation.
Italicized What conclusions did I make? What cases did I push forward with my speculation? This One I used my speculation to create standards which I used to scumhunt. I pushed NightFury with these standards.
4. Yes it is, but it is still the truth of how I felt.
5. I think the logic of your cases against me is equally horrible, so at least it is mutual.
Something about zelblade that needs to be said. Many of us (including me) believed he is town because of the ridiculous and crazy response FourFace made to my initial case. However, with nttea flipping medic, we know that FourFace fakeclaimed doctor. I am of the opinion now that FourFace's craziness no longer exonerates zelblade. I am obviously biased against zelblade because I think he is making bad cases against me. All that I am asking of you is to put him back on the table when you are considering who is suspicious.
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+ Show Spoiler +On March 04 2012 13:35 k2hd wrote:In response to zelblade: Despite the pressure on him, I am still not totally convinced that alderan is mafia. He stuck his neck out on day 1 with his case against chocolate (this is I believe the first case made in the whole game), and I don't see why mafia would do this. He drove a lot of discussion on day 1, and I don't see why mafia would want to do this, rather than letting discussion stagnate or focus on the wrong things (we spent a LOT of time debating the merits of a soft deadline). He was bringing the spotlight onto himself, increasing the chance that his posting would be scrutinised more closely (which happened). The above paragraph alone isn't enough, but his voting pattern also suggests town to me. He voted steve day 1 and me for day 2. He did not want a chocolate lynch (who I still believe is town from my previous post), or an igabod/nttea lynch, who has since flipped blue. I obviously know I am town (still unsure about testsubject), but alderan does not. He could've helped in getting a lynch on an easy target in igabod/nttea (at the time there was a real chance of igabod being lynched), but chose steve instead. On day 2 he votes for me and keeps his vote on me when there was still the danger of a no lynch. I hope he can explain his absence when he gets back. As for DoYouHas, I now find it VERY suspicious that after making these 2 posts (also used in sloosh's case): post 1post 2He still has not responded to this post (in regards to the nightfury issue): phagga's postThe only post he makes addressing phagga's post is this one: + Show Spoiler +On March 02 2012 02:45 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2012 20:58 phagga wrote: 2 The question you should ask yourself here is: Is this something a townie would do? And if so, is it also something scum would do? I doubt scum would want to stay in the spotlight like that.
Also, If you are town, and you feel strongly about someone being scum, what are you gonna do? - Try to push a lynch on that person even if people will not listen to you - let the person of the hook because noone listens to you, and pick another target
I would be stupid to push his lynch so hard if I was scum and knew he was town. When he would get lynched and flipped green, everyone would be on my heels. You do not want that as scum, specially not so early in the game.
This is wrong. It is equally as possible that mafia would tunnel someone that hard. Tunneling someone into a lynch, on a green flip, makes it very hard for the town to determine whether it was just bad town play or scummy play. It is an easy way for a scum to get into and out of the spotlight without offering anything more than a null read on them. It also lowers the town's expectations for them for the rest of the game. Similarly, being willing to back off a case is just as often a trait of a townie who has changed their mind as it is a scum who wants a bandwagon. WIFOM my friend, WIFOM. I also find myself oddly comfortable with either a k2hd, gumshoe, or Alderan lynch. I think they all have good reasons to be lynched, but I will wait a little longer to see what people think before I make my preference clear. No mention of why he let nightfury off so easily. + Show Spoiler +On March 03 2012 04:10 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2012 03:25 slOosh wrote:DYH:Before D2 I've been on the fence with DYH as on one side it does look like he is trying to contribute and drive discussion, but on the other he is flip flopping a lot and seems really unsure of his reads. I understand your desire to lynch the hard lurker - but I really don't want N2 and D3 to be dominated by discussion of the validity of policy lynches. My questions for you still remain: Did you think that k2hd was a better choice solely based on comparison to gumshoe? Do you still think that he is a good lynch suspect for tomorrow?
We need as much info as we can get and we can pick up discussion on nttea lynch if you still feel inclined to do during D3, but it doesn't make sense to do it now at night since you could die and mafia might WIFOM stuff up if your reads and stances aren't clear. No I didn't think k2hd was a better choice solely based on comparison to gumshoe. He was someone that I found suspicious when I was making my case against NightFury because he met many of the scum standards I was using to accuse NightFury. I do think he is a good suspect for tomorrow. Or why I do not get the same treatment as nightfury. He left for his trip AFTER phagga made his post, and has ignored the nightfury issue. As for sloosh, I am on the fence, but leaning town. I am ready to re-evaluate after today's lynch, if alderan or DoYouHas are lynched and flip green. Btw, chocolate, can you not post like that (your phagga case). It was extremely hard to read. Still believe chocolate is town because I doubt mafia team would let him make cases like that...
k2hd, you do not get the same treatment because you used a similar defense and you were second. You had the opportunity to play off of NightFury's response, so I was not going to treat you the same.
As for the way I acted towards NightFury. After his response (which did strike me as earnest), I knew I wasn't going to make myself any more or less certain of his alignment by continuing to batter away at him. So instead I decided to play of an attitude I saw in his defense. Namely that he felt like he couldn't do anything that wouldn't throw suspicion on him. So I decided I would give him a strong town read from me and see where he ran with it. If he took my quick turnaround as a blank check to continue lurking or posting poorly, then he was probably scum. If he took my quick turnaround as a vote of confidence and his new posts showed that new confidence, then he was probably town. (note that this cannot work if I tell anyone about it)
What has he shown in his more recent posts? Confidence and content. I lean town for him.
As for you k2hd, I don't know what to think, in my quick read through of what I missed I did like a few of the things you posted.
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slOosh- DoYouHas I'll just list things that add up to build up my read, as posting quotes is too messy and difficult to read. You can read his filter alongside as this is loosely chronological. - Voting patterns. I pointed it out above in his relation with k2hd. - His instantaneous drop of his NightFury case, only to pick it up on k2hd with the same reasoning. - Weird vote switch from k2hd to nttea and back - Flip flopping on gumshoe - Using "you voted gumshoe" as considerable reason for suspicion - Jumping straight for a nttea lynch, and not providing much anything else when probed for information
It's hard to point out "scummy" posts because all his reads and stances are weak, unsure and flip flopping. He doesn't push or pressure for anything, and the only people he has gone after this game are easy to pick on players (Fourface, k2hd and nttea).
Finally, add in the weird interactions between DYH and Alderan where there is sheeping and soft defending, asking each other easy-to-respond-to clarification questions, establishing "interactions" so if one flips the other isn't suspected due to them being missing from filters or whatnot.
-Voting patterns. D1, I have rehashed this plenty. D2, Why should I have switched to gumshoe? You didn't need me to make a majority, if I had you would just be calling me out for bandwagoning instead of for being on the right side of a lynch. You will not convince me that I was wrong to vote nttea. You play like that, you get lynched.
-Dropping of NightFury case I just explained.
- Weird vote switch from k2hd to nttea and back. We had an iffy case against gumshoe, I was somewhat more confident in the ones against k2hd, and a person who had just done something unquestionably scummy. Even if it was a last minute vote switch and bandwagon, that is the best choice. You don't ignore scum tells just because they come late in the day.
- Flip flopping on gumshoe. Wishy-washy yes, flip-floppy no. I made it clear that I did not think gumshoe was the best lynch, but if it came to it I was willing to vote him to avoid a no-lynch.
- Using "you voted gumshoe" as considerable reason for suspicion. You will have to give me the quote for this one, I don't want to dig through my filter searching for this when a vote deadline is imminent.
-Interactions between DYH and Alderan. I feel vaguely insulted by this. You know that Alderan plays solidly as scum. I have already mentioned that I look for these soft defenses and easy interactions when I am scumhunting. Yet you think that both of us would be stupid enough to be that obvious. If both Alderan and I were scum, you are right, we would not ignore eachother, but our interactions would also not be this stupidly obvious. Throw Chocolate onto the pile too. I have soft defended him by tearing down bad arguments against him. I do think it is amusing that zelblade accuses me with the assumption that I play well and you accuse me with the assumption that I play terribly.
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So now I find myself between a rock and a hard place. The lynch is either going to be me or Alderan or no-lynch.
A no-lynch is the worst thing that could happen to this town (already inactive and demoralized).
Alright slOosh, you win. I'll vote Alderan in spite of my leaning town on him. But you had better believe that if he flips green I am going to come after you with a vengeance night3/day4.
##Unvote: nttea ##Vote: Alderan
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