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On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake!
It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it...
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On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it...
It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue.
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On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue.
For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.
Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned.
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I think I've found a problem with some of the images they included. Most photographic prints are produced using magenta, cyan, and yellow dye. The reason these colors are selected for subtractive color mixing is because each one absorbs exactly one of the primary colors (which are red, green and blue). The primary colors are determined by the human eye, which estimates the wavelength of light by using 3 types of sensors, each most sensitive to a certain color of light on the visible spectrum. For example, a green cone produces maximum signal when stimulated by green light, and the signal gets weaker as you move away from green in either direction. The red cone is most sensitive to red light, and the signal gets weaker as you move further away in either direction.
By comparing the signal strength that a light creates on nearby cone cells the brain can estimate the color of the light. For example, a red light creates a strong signal in the red cone and very little signal in the green cone, while a yellow light produces a mediocre signal in both the red and green cone. However, because the eye only uses 3 points to estimate the color of light, it can be fooled. For example, if you "see" yellow, you could be seeing light with a wavelength of 570nm, or you could be seeing a mixture of red and green light.
The primary colors used to produce the colors that we see (which are red, green and blue) are specifically tuned to the colors that our cone cells are most sensitive to. That allows a television to fool us into seeing yellow light by feeding us a mixture of red and green that stimulates our red and green cone cells equally.
There is no guarantee that alien life forms that are capable of detecting light would have their cone cells tuned to the same frequency. This would mean that images produced with the primary colors designed to simulate images for human eyes would not necessarily produce a realistic image to an alien life form (note that even though printed images use subtractive color mixing instead of additive, where magenta, cyan, and yellow inks are each used to subtract one of the primary colors of light from the picture, the effictiveness of the image is still tied to the human cone cells).
Furthermore, alien cone cells could be tuned to an entirely different part of the electromagnetic spectrum, and they would therefore not even be able to see visible light in the first place! For example, an alien could have cone cells at far-red, near infrared, and slightly-less near infrared, a spectrum which has very little overlap with our visible spectrum! In cases like that, the image might not make ANY sense at all, since who knows what the absorption properties of the inks used in the printing are at whatever frequencies of the electromagnetic spectrum the aliens are capable of seeing. For all we know, the image might look to them like a blank piece of paper, if all the inks had approximately the same reflectance level of the paper the image was printed on.
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On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot. Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned.
Also the metric system would not necessarily be any easier for aliens to work with since they don't necessarily use base-10.
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On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned.
Whose foot? People have different feet. But I understand your idea and I agree that assuming that most feet are roughly similar in length, the meter stick seems awfully arbitrary... but the problem isn't about being arbitrary. It's that most of the world and the large majority of the scientific community uses the metric system.
But
Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge.
I disagree, that isn't their job. There are other space agencies in the world. Even though NASA has accomplished much more demanding goals, they don't "represent" humanity. Also, I don't think aliens would care if humans used the metric system instead of the imperial system lol
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from 2012 August,
increase in cosmic rays,
![[image loading]](http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/files/2012/10/v1pg.3m-600x461.gif)
particles from solar wind,
![[image loading]](http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/files/2012/10/voyagerla1rate-600x492.jpg)
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On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot. Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned.
really? did you just graduate from kindergarten? find me at least 10 people whose foot measure exactly one foot...
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On June 29 2013 11:39 sorrowptoss wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. Whose foot? People have different feet. But I understand your idea and I agree that assuming that most feet are roughly similar in length, the meter stick seems awfully arbitrary... but the problem isn't about being arbitrary. It's that most of the world and the large majority of the scientific community uses the metric system. But Show nested quote +Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. I disagree, that isn't their job. There are other space agencies in the world. Even though NASA has accomplished much more demanding goals, they don't "represent" humanity. Also, I don't think aliens would care if humans used the metric system instead of the imperial system lol
IT is their job to "represent humanity's scientific knowledge", and that scientific knowledge I was referring to here is the use of metric over foot! read and think before you reply?
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On June 29 2013 11:46 aNGryaRchon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:39 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. Whose foot? People have different feet. But I understand your idea and I agree that assuming that most feet are roughly similar in length, the meter stick seems awfully arbitrary... but the problem isn't about being arbitrary. It's that most of the world and the large majority of the scientific community uses the metric system. But Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. I disagree, that isn't their job. There are other space agencies in the world. Even though NASA has accomplished much more demanding goals, they don't "represent" humanity. Also, I don't think aliens would care if humans used the metric system instead of the imperial system lol IT is their job to "represent humanity's scientific knowledge", and that scientific knowledge I was referring to here is the use of metric over foot! read and think before you reply?
i really dont think the aliens care whether we use metric or not
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IT is their job to "represent humanity's scientific knowledge", and that scientific knowledge I was referring to here is the use of metric over foot! read and think before you reply?
Yea I know that's what you said, I misworded in my reply, and I said that I disagreed with that idea. I also said that using the metric system versus using the imperial system is just a small part of humanity's scientific knowledge and that it doesn't really matter to aliens. Sorry if that didn't come through.
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On June 29 2013 11:44 aNGryaRchon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot. Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. really? did you just graduate from kindergarten? find me at least 10 people whose foot measure exactly one foot...
1) Who cares if it isn't exact?
2) Any system of measurement will be arbitrary as far as the aliens are concerned. They would have chosen different constants to define their base units on.
On June 29 2013 11:46 aNGryaRchon wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:39 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. Whose foot? People have different feet. But I understand your idea and I agree that assuming that most feet are roughly similar in length, the meter stick seems awfully arbitrary... but the problem isn't about being arbitrary. It's that most of the world and the large majority of the scientific community uses the metric system. But Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. I disagree, that isn't their job. There are other space agencies in the world. Even though NASA has accomplished much more demanding goals, they don't "represent" humanity. Also, I don't think aliens would care if humans used the metric system instead of the imperial system lol IT is their job to "represent humanity's scientific knowledge", and that scientific knowledge I was referring to here is the use of metric over foot! read and think before you reply?
It doesn't really matter what system of units you use, so long as you're consistent.
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If we made a new voyager, one with much increased speed, couldn't we explore more in less time? Oh and give it better battery(?) life
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On June 29 2013 12:09 -niL wrote:
If we made a new voyager, one with much increased speed, couldn't we explore more in less time? Oh and give it better battery(?) life
Yes, but where do we get the funding for a new voyager? Especially when it doesn't yield immediate returns? Tax-payers may not be happy to fund it :/
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On June 29 2013 12:04 Millitron wrote:Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:44 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot. Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. really? did you just graduate from kindergarten? find me at least 10 people whose foot measure exactly one foot... 1) Who cares if it isn't exact? 2) Any system of measurement will be arbitrary as far as the aliens are concerned. They would have chosen different constants to define their base units on. Show nested quote +On June 29 2013 11:46 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:39 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:28 Millitron wrote:On June 29 2013 11:24 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:18 sorrowptoss wrote:On June 29 2013 11:16 aNGryaRchon wrote:On June 29 2013 11:10 On_Slaught wrote:
It gives me chills thinking about how truly alone these probes are. During every second of every day these things are floating out there in the literal middle of nowhere. Furthest humanity has ever stretched its influence, and possibly ever will. Though I'd like to think that hundreds, if not thousands of years from now how cool it would be if a human ship found one of these things. Cool thing to imagine. goof thing these probes are not sentient, or else they would have died from psychosomatic illnesses due to depression or would have just committed suicide. another thing, why is it in non-metric? 12 inches and 12 feet??!!! Seriously NASA, you are a science institution for god's sake! It's not an issue if they put the metric value in parentheses right beside it... It is an issue here since the base measurement they used is non-metric. Is there any significance to having a 12 foot antenna, which converts to 3.7 meters? Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. Putting the metric value is an external issue. For once, imperial measurement is non-arbitrary, since they included images of people. One foot is the length of the man's foot.Metric would actually be more arbitrary, as far as any aliens are concerned. Whose foot? People have different feet. But I understand your idea and I agree that assuming that most feet are roughly similar in length, the meter stick seems awfully arbitrary... but the problem isn't about being arbitrary. It's that most of the world and the large majority of the scientific community uses the metric system. But Obviously they had feet-measurement in mind when building this thing, which I find troubling because they are supposed to represent humanity's scientific knowledge. I disagree, that isn't their job. There are other space agencies in the world. Even though NASA has accomplished much more demanding goals, they don't "represent" humanity. Also, I don't think aliens would care if humans used the metric system instead of the imperial system lol IT is their job to "represent humanity's scientific knowledge", and that scientific knowledge I was referring to here is the use of metric over foot! read and think before you reply? It doesn't really matter what system of units you use, so long as you're consistent.
Look here, one is a system, one is not. Which is which?!
10 millimeters = 1 centimeter
10 centimeters = 1 decimeter
10 decimeters = 1 meter
10 meters = 1 decameter
10 decameters = 1 hectometer
10 hectometers = 1 kilometer
![[image loading]](http://fhm.fhsd.k12.mo.us/jhughes/Hughes/Units/Measurement/Obj%201%20Standardization/English%20Lengths.jpg)
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10 millimeters = 1 centimeter
10 centimeters = 1 decimeter
10 decimeters = 1 meter
10 meters = 1 decameter
10 decameters = 1 kilometer hectometer
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On June 29 2013 12:43 codonbyte wrote:Show nested quote +10 millimeters = 1 centimeter
10 centimeters = 1 decimeter
10 decimeters = 1 meter
10 meters = 1 decameter
10 decameters = 1 kilometer hectometer
typo error :p
besides i edited before your post :p
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It's amazing what we've been able to achieve. Still blows my mind that these 2 space probes have traveled such a vast distance. Makes me sad that space exploration isn't what it used to be  .
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On June 29 2013 10:37 Le Cheque Zo wrote:
I loled at "The Sounds of Earth" in the disc... what are the chances that the aliens have actually evolved a language similar to English right?
It seems reasonable. I mean, that's what happens in Star Trek, right?!
In all seriousness, I love the fact that we sent the Voyagers out not only as explorers, but also messengers. The likelihood of them ever being examined by intelligent beings is incredibly remote, but still, it's just so romantic. I think Carl Sagan really knew what he was doing by trying to bring science and space exploration to the masses. We no longer have a cosmic ambassador that's quite as charismatic or wise as he was. Nowadays if anyone wanted to do something similar in a space project, it would probably be shot down as "impractical" or not within the project budget. His idea to shoot the Pale Blue Dot image despite the risks to the camera was equally brilliant, for the same reasons. As a species, we needed to hear his message about the importance of space exploration for more than just political and economic incentives.
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EPT
