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I decided to post this here because it isn't just about SC, but man, SC is as bad about it as any game (maybe even more so than WoW). Why does everyone hate noobs so much? This isn't a rant, I generally would like to hear from people as to why they think that noob-thumping has become so popular, and whether or not it's justified.
I get that sometimes it's frustrating to have to deal with people who don't know as much as you. I also get that some people like to feel superior via condescension. And, of course, there is the occassional noob that knows very little but thinks they have it all figured out. But...
Everyone had to be new at some point. Sometimes, on the TL forums, I'll see a post with someone being like "how should I counter this army?" And a few people will actually be helpful while many others essentially say "you should suck less." I have this experience with other games...if I play a FPS that I've never played before with certain people, they'll totally be either rude or impatient with how little I knew about the toasted-chicken gun, or whatever particular quirks the game has.
Why do you think that the gaming community has taken on such a noob resentful attitude? Do you think that other things (aka., sports, art, etc.) have as frequent of arrogance? And, what other activities have you done where people have treated you with hostility for a lack of knowledge?
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Russian Federation4106 Posts
No one hates noobs.
People hate noobs that think they know everything.
SC2 brought an army of them here.
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Noob spotted.
User was temp banned for this post.
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I would say it's because gamers tend to be somewhat elitist, and it fuels their ego to demean those less skilled than themselves. Not everybody, of course, but that's definitely a reason.
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On December 01 2010 04:15 Aeres wrote:
I would say it's because gamers tend to be somewhat elitist, and it fuels their ego to demean those less skilled than themselves. Not everybody, of course, but that's definitely a reason.
Exactly this, everyone(for the most part) wants to believe that they are better then others. In my opinion, it accounts for all the hostility, etc.
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In a way, I figured most everything out myself when it comes to games by doing my own reading and practice. So I don't really see how noobs are noobs....I mean I may be a noob for a short period of time while still learning but that period has never lasted long at all. Like HoN, I knew my shit pretty good after a few weeks, I still messed up at times and the inevitable team fails were pretty bad, but I wasn't dumb.
I guess I sorta lump "stupid" and "bad at video games" in the same spot. I don't like stupid people >.<
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I don't hate noobs. I do what I can to help them. ^^; I do however hate noobs that join a team or clan I am in.
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On December 01 2010 04:15 Nutro wrote:
Noob spotted.
Lol, jerk. 
I may have the skills of a noob, but I have the heart of a better noob! =D
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The problem with newbies opening threads is that they usually put very little effort in the OPs and dont follow the strategy guidelines. Just look at the percentage of how many of those threads have a replay included.
Also it's often more of a rant about how SC2 is imba then someone just looking for help.
Comments like "you should suck less" are however not accepted here either and I'd be surprised if someone posted that and didn't get temp banned for it.
Just SC2- related there could also be the problem of the new ladder system and how everybody thinks he is amazing because he is a 2000 diamond player.
Also, it's the internet and these games are competitive -> people become more aggressive than they ever would if they met that person in real life
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ignorance is not bliss, its conformist.
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There are two types of noobs, those who listen and those who don't, its the latter the majority of people hate because they refuse to improve and think they know everything there is to know.
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On December 01 2010 04:17 Ashera wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 04:15 Aeres wrote:
I would say it's because gamers tend to be somewhat elitist, and it fuels their ego to demean those less skilled than themselves. Not everybody, of course, but that's definitely a reason. Exactly this, everyone(for the most part) wants to believe that they are better then others. In my opinion, it accounts for all the hostility, etc.
You are not accounting anonymity - Alot of sad nerds likes to pretend they're badasses and are doing so through the game because they can play that role.. A shrink could probably write a ton of papers about nerds with skizo-like behavior when they are online.. Only, they're not because again.. No one knows who they are
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On December 01 2010 04:20 7mk wrote:
The problem with newbies opening threads is that they usually put very little effort in the OPs and dont follow the strategy guidelines. Just look at the percentage of how many of those threads have a replay included.
Also it's often more of a rant about how SC2 is imba then someone just looking for help.
Comments like "you should suck less" are however not accepted here either and I'd be surprised if someone posted that and didn't get temp banned for it.
They usually don't literally say, "you should suck less," but sometimes they'll remark about a players skill when it isn't appropriate. For example, a person may ask, "what units should I have built to counter void rays," and someone will respond only with things like, "you should have better macro." Well, DUH, you should always have better macro, and the guy didn't really address the question.
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Noobs like me tend to be very arrogant and think that there way is best. They don't understand that there are people better then them. This is especially true for StarCraft, especially when you try to explain to someone why this doesn't work and they just sit back there and don't care for what you say.
Often noobs are loud mouths, again especially in StarCraft, when you beat a 'noob' they always come back and bad mouth you just because what they been doing has been so easily beaten.
So people don't like noobs because they are arrogant and they are all talk.
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I have no problems with people that are new to the game. But people that are new to TL and have not lurked a while and read the commandments are kinda annoying.
Oh and ofcourse the "know it all" noobs as previous people stated.
Prime example of annoying noobs was a guy posting a thread asking for help. I gave advice and he rejected them due to lack of knowledge. I wrote an explenation to my point but since he apparently stopped reading his thread it didnt help much.
Another funny one is the people claiming that every attack before 10min is a cheese for some reason.
The majority of new members here are awesome and great but unfortunately the idiots always stand out.
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Zurich14662 Posts
First of all, people don't hate newbs. Nobody hates people because they are bad at the game, especially not the ones at the top. I am not denying that many people, including myself, can get frustrated by dealing with stubborn bad players. But hate is the wrong word.
On December 01 2010 04:13 sparkyk24 wrote:
And, of course, there is the occassional noob that knows very little but thinks they have it all figured out. But...
And here you already have figured out yourself where this frustration mentioned above comes from. It's the people that don't have a clue but feel the need to lecture that generate this kind of hostility you are describing.
This, combined with the tradition here many of TL's veterans know and miss lately, may result in rather harsh wording towards those people.
That being said, if you see people unwarrantably "hating" on newbs, report them to a moderator. This is not tolerated around here.
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On December 01 2010 04:23 sparkyk24 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 04:20 7mk wrote:
The problem with newbies opening threads is that they usually put very little effort in the OPs and dont follow the strategy guidelines. Just look at the percentage of how many of those threads have a replay included.
Also it's often more of a rant about how SC2 is imba then someone just looking for help.
Comments like "you should suck less" are however not accepted here either and I'd be surprised if someone posted that and didn't get temp banned for it. They usually don't literally say, "you should suck less," but sometimes they'll remark about a players skill when it isn't appropriate. For example, a person may ask, "what units should I have built to counter void rays," and someone will respond only with things like, "you should have better macro." Well, DUH, you should always have better macro, and the guy didn't really address the question.
Mh yea that's true unfortunately
you could blame the SC2 ranking system, where everyone thinks he's the shit since he's 2000 diamond ranking, when in reality that takes less effort than getting C lvl on iccup.
But it's a competitive game, it's always about being better than your opponent, so I guess that bit of pride sometimes fades over to the forums too.
And like I edited into that post you quoted, it's the internet and people tend to be more aggressive etc. than if they met a person in real life.
If you meet idra in real life, he isn't constantly gonna go tell you to fuck yourself either.
Also with sc2 there was a huge influx of people, some of them might be right in their puberty, having some issues with their daddy and mom, and decide to let that out on internet strangers.
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On December 01 2010 04:14 Tien wrote:
No one hates noobs.
People hate noobs that think they know everything.
SC2 brought an army of them here.
Yep this is 200% true.
Noobs willing to learn and listen are usually welcomes with open arms.
Then there are noobs who don't realize they are noobs and think they are the shit. When you try to give them advice they argue with you. People don't like when their time is wasted.
But there will always be the few self righteous assholes who refuse to help anyone anywhere.
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On December 01 2010 04:23 sparkyk24 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 04:20 7mk wrote:
The problem with newbies opening threads is that they usually put very little effort in the OPs and dont follow the strategy guidelines. Just look at the percentage of how many of those threads have a replay included.
Also it's often more of a rant about how SC2 is imba then someone just looking for help.
Comments like "you should suck less" are however not accepted here either and I'd be surprised if someone posted that and didn't get temp banned for it. They usually don't literally say, "you should suck less," but sometimes they'll remark about a players skill when it isn't appropriate. For example, a person may ask, "what units should I have built to counter void rays," and someone will respond only with things like, "you should have better macro." Well, DUH, you should always have better macro, and the guy didn't really address the question.
For 99% of threads "you should suck less" rephrased is the best answer. At some point, noobs asking "how do i counter ________" need to realize that Starcraft is NOT about finding the magical solution to win. It's about playing better than your opponent, which for the lower leagues does mean "you should have better macro". Or scouting, in the case of void rays. As for what units you should make to beat void rays... well you should make something that shoots air, DUH. The simple truth is, unless the game is horribly imbalanced, "sucking less" is the best "counter" to whatever you're losing to.
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On December 01 2010 04:23 sparkyk24 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2010 04:20 7mk wrote:
The problem with newbies opening threads is that they usually put very little effort in the OPs and dont follow the strategy guidelines. Just look at the percentage of how many of those threads have a replay included.
Also it's often more of a rant about how SC2 is imba then someone just looking for help.
Comments like "you should suck less" are however not accepted here either and I'd be surprised if someone posted that and didn't get temp banned for it. They usually don't literally say, "you should suck less," but sometimes they'll remark about a players skill when it isn't appropriate. For example, a person may ask, "what units should I have built to counter void rays," and someone will respond only with things like, "you should have better macro." Well, DUH, you should always have better macro, and the guy didn't really address the question.
The point is of course that the new player shouldn't even worry about what units counter what when they don't even have the very basics of macro down.
Now if all someone says is "macro better" then of course that advice isn't very good but if they embellish on the macro better point then I don't see what's wrong with that.
Nobody dislikes noobs. Obviously everyone is a noob at some point. The difference is that most people actually make a conscious effort to improve instead of running to the SC2 strategy forums and creating a thread with little content, no replay and expect to have everyone spell out the obvious for them.
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EPT
