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On January 07 2015 06:19 lolfail9001 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 06:08 Dead9 wrote: u can pick what hero u go on with ulti... also desolate works next to neutrals 1. You wasted haunt for pick-offs? Those pick-offs better be really worth it, understand? 2. It's tricky, sometimes (if neutrals are in aggro mode), it does not. so do u not plan to haunt for kills? unless ur ulting an underleveled maiden or smth its usually worth it desolate used to be bugged iirc but it was fixed a while ago, or at least i havent noticed any problems in a long time
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 07 2015 07:15 Dead9 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 06:19 lolfail9001 wrote:On January 07 2015 06:08 Dead9 wrote: u can pick what hero u go on with ulti... also desolate works next to neutrals 1. You wasted haunt for pick-offs? Those pick-offs better be really worth it, understand? 2. It's tricky, sometimes (if neutrals are in aggro mode), it does not. so do u not plan to haunt for kills? unless ur ulting an underleveled maiden or smth its usually worth it desolate used to be bugged iirc but it was fixed a while ago, or at least i havent noticed any problems in a long time I haunt primarily for something i can profit with. In early game it's pickoffs if lane is pushed into my side and offlaner is not under his tower so i can reality rift back after ksing (or not, if it looks to be a more than a single kill gold), later on it's teamfights that look to be profitable. Though i won't lie, i may sometimes waste haunt for scouting purposes (jk, due to my own stupidity, obviously).
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If I play in the trench and people don't know what a trilane is what should I do with spectre; I have a friend who will play support, but I only see a gank from mid every 3 games or so, I don't think I've ever seen a rotation from the offlane. What support would be best for 2v2 safelane spectre? Lich or silencer I'm thinking, is that the best? Also is 2v1 mid spectre good, and what support is good for that? And how should we play it?
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Don't play spectre is the real answer in those situations.
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I don't think thats the real answer, it's just an excuse to not play the hero. I think the main problem when picking supports is that people believe you NEED a ranged one, but actually some of the best defensive/counteragressive heroes are melee (Abbadon, Omniknight). Ranged sups are really frail and will mostly feed if your carry can't stop your opponents with any spell. If you are really sure you are gonna be 2v2 and it's a trench, have your buddy pick Undying. 2 hero decays are really strong, and if they ever go for you he can drop tombstone and get a double kill if they commit. Also you HAVE TO start stout-tango-salve, upgrade to PMS as soon as possible and get a stick. These 2 items are ownage in action-packed lanes and you should always get them before boots. You can get an OoV if you are starting to come ahead.
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Well to be honest, most dual lanes vs dual lanes situations with a spectre will be rough. If you think you will have a hard time playing under alot of pressure with spectre, maybe you should consider picking another hero. Anyway, with that said, I think robaq is mostly right. The main priority with spectre is just not feeding their offlane, and get whatever farm you can (unless you have a trilane, life in lane will always be pretty hard for spectre). So picking something that can keep her alive makes alot of sense. Spectre is really good at playing the catch-up game though so that kinda compensates for her really poor laning abilities.
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im in the low MMR trench and am 4-0 with Spec in the last month. i get quell unless its good tri vs solo. so in 2v2 it helps alot for lane and the neutral camp(s). buy it at side shop, cause as said above always start with sheild, tango, salve, when having a duel lane. also go dagger and dispersion as theres no reason to get desolate cause they wont be alone (i think you arent suppose to get this anyway). skip ult at 6 cause you ll be behind and not that useful. use dagger for LH as often as possible.
disclaimer: remember im under 3k
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Dont let spectre die + get kills at lvl 6 and onwards. I think lich and silencer are good picks too, but silencer is a bit greedy depending on what you are facing, still i like silencer in pubs just because his ultimate is a global and he gets free int. If you face axe pick bane, problem solved.
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1 point in dispersion is fine. Desolate is spectre strongest early and midgame tool. 2/2/1 or 3/1/1 at level 5 should be your build, depending on the situation
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Never ever max dispersion before the other 2 spells.
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I'm certainly not a spectre player, but I don't think laning should be your priority when thinking about who to pick with spectre because spectre is going to lose to pretty much any agressive lane, no matter what your support is. IMO, you should instead think about picking your other 4 heroes so that they can make space for spectre to farm and give her opportunities to haunt in for kills.
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Its that damn "Guide by XBOCT" that has maxing Dispersion.
And jeez, I reread that comment, and boy it is bad.
* Haunt at 6 is mandatory. The reason Spectre is even picked nowaday is because of her ability to get assist gold globally.
* Using Dagger to farm early game is a terrible idea. Pushing out the lane while free farming = wasting time as creeps die to tower. Spectre can't jungle, so its not like you're farming neutrals or something in the meantime.
* Using dagger for farming means that you don't have any mana to escape.
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On February 05 2015 06:55 mooo wrote: im in the low MMR trench and am 4-0 with Spec in the last month. i get quell unless its good tri vs solo. so in 2v2 it helps alot for lane and the neutral camp(s). buy it at side shop, cause as said above always start with sheild, tango, salve, when having a duel lane. also go dagger and dispersion as theres no reason to get desolate cause they wont be alone (i think you arent suppose to get this anyway). skip ult at 6 cause you ll be behind and not that useful. use dagger for LH as often as possible.
disclaimer: remember im under 3k Almost everything you said was wrong. The only thing I agree with is a stout/tango/salve is probably the best opening most of the time. Sometimes I open with a quelling/stout/tango and ferry over more regen if needed based off what lane I see. It's fine to do this as long as you get the regen early and don't offset your mids bottle timing by too much.
Jungling with spectre is terrible before your radiance, so always choose lane whenever possible even if it means you have to walk a bit. When you are scared make sure to stay safely away from enemy initiation range if you aren't sure its safe, that means stay near the tree line and only walk up for your last hit if you don't have wards and/or don't know where the enemies with kill potential are.
As some other people said, in a difficult lane you get 1 level of dispersion if you really think you need it. Avoid it whenever possible because having dagger and desolate are what let you get kills. Desolate makes your haunts hit really hard, dagger might be a bit more useful in lane. Even against a dual lane I guarantee you will have times where you can get desolate procs, particularly when you are going for kills when the enemy splits up, or after you kill one the other is trying to flee. At level 11 you should be 4-4-1-2 100% of games. Leveling dispersion ruins your mid game potential to get kills further gimping your team during your weakest phase before your radiance is complete.
Your mana is very important. When you haunt you want to be able to use a dagger to secure a kill. You can't just dagger creeps to get creeps because you have precious few mana and need to conserve it to keep yourself alive by daggering into the trees, or to secure kills in your lane, or securing haunt kills. I've dabled with some urn/aquila build to allow more spamming but I don't think it was really justified slowing your radiance by 2k gold.. One of the items is enough to increase your farm, damage, or survivability enough if you deem that necessary.
Never, ever, ever skip your ult, particularly if you are behind. Spectre's catchup mechanism is her haunt and teamfight contribution, so you want to have as much dagger and desolate to maximize that when you are behind, and you need to get haunt so that you can use those ability with your team, who ideally should be 4 manning when your ult is off cooldown in order to capitalize on the edge haunt gives early on.
Hope that helps a bit.
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On February 02 2015 07:12 Jct0064 wrote: If I play in the trench and people don't know what a trilane is what should I do with spectre; I have a friend who will play support, but I only see a gank from mid every 3 games or so, I don't think I've ever seen a rotation from the offlane. What support would be best for 2v2 safelane spectre? Lich or silencer I'm thinking, is that the best? Also is 2v1 mid spectre good, and what support is good for that? And how should we play it? those are alright supports, but honestly any decently aggression lane and you aren't going to be able to CS at all. What I do in those situation is absorb exp and get kills with haunt. This is better if your supports just leave lane so you get more exp. Alternatively, you can have your support pull on CD and you can creep under tower which is a good alternative. Use your haunt to recover, and eventually the other offlaners will leave you and you can use that time to free farm. Most important thing is to not die/feed and make sure you are aware of haunt opportunities.
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Lich + Spectre dual mid is/was a fairly common combo. Spectre solo mid can also be an option against a weak mid like Pudge
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I'm pretty sure pudge could just rot and run at you through the lane, then hook you. I've ran it mid, the exp is nice and you get okay CS depending on the lane. Nice part is not needing to leave lane to gank, so you get that advantage over your opponent.
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Well, he could do that with other melee mid as well, so its not like Spectre is the only one with that problem. Fast boot + bottle and back off when he moves aggressively toward you usually deal with it most of the time.
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On February 06 2015 08:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I'm pretty sure pudge could just rot and run at you through the lane, then hook you. I've ran it mid, the exp is nice and you get okay CS depending on the lane. Nice part is not needing to leave lane to gank, so you get that advantage over your opponent. how about you man up since you got your creeps and hit him back ? I'm fairly certain pudge dies first
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Spectre is comparably weaker in lane compared to pretty much any mid. TA hits like a truck, DK has strong nuke/stuns and comparable strength to a pudge.
It's pointless to argue really, as I said you can mid but that lane in particular wouldn't benefit you too much. You could man up, but you will most likely lose unless you have something like 3 levels of desolate at 5, where it might be close, but by then hook is hitting for 270 pure when you have an hp pool of maybe 700.
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noone is asking you to tank the hook... you just fight in your creeps and win
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