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Caldeum1977 Posts
On September 29 2014 19:18 Cascade wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2014 22:47 Valiver wrote:On September 28 2014 01:03 Cascade wrote:On September 27 2014 23:47 Valiver wrote:On September 27 2014 09:35 Cascade wrote:On September 26 2014 23:06 Valiver wrote:On September 26 2014 18:42 Cascade wrote:
How does starpact (uses up all your mana, more damage the more mana you have) work together with power hungry (next spell is cast for free). It still empties my mana pool when I cast star pact with power hungry, but does it do more damage? If you use star pact I think it costs 40 arcane power to cast and then takes up the rest of your resources. Power hungry pays that initial 40 arcane power for you, so you get more bonus damage. That makes sense, thanks. How did you know? I've tried star pact before for fun and I tested it to make sure it works  What build did you use? I got critical hits up to half a billion everything included, but don't think I averaged more damage than my disintegrate build, and certainly less crowd control. But it is fun to one-shot champion packs on t5 rifts with two players. Yeah it's a terrible build solo, but was fun to try. It's been awhile but I think the build I did was something like - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#aPQSjN!ZXTY!aZaZacI also tried this build - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#aPYSjN!iaTY!aZcZac to try to get as high a crit as possible but I don't remember what I got to =/ Ok, cool. My build was more like your second one. I used the shield giving you higher max energy instead of black hole. Black hole is just annying: I cant use it before meteor as it takes the charges away, and I cant use it after, as my mana is empty... Any spender is taking dps from the metoer. I ended up using slow time or teleport instead. I think a major difference was a two-hander instead of a one-hander. I even found that two-hnader which lowers cost of meteor in the first rift I played with the build which was awesome. It is really crap solo, but in group with tanks it could potentially be comparable with my disintegrate build with optimised gear. I was still running around with a lot of +disintegrate gear, a few ias and so on. Specially for elites. It is clearly worse for cleaning up whites. But yeah, I don't ever see it going beyond a (fun!) messing-around build without major patches.
The way I got black hole to work with the build was to get up to 4 stacks of arcane dynamo, then use black hole so it wouldn't use any stacks (since it has to use all 5 at once), then wait a second for arcane power to go back up from black hole (it only costs 20 ap so it really is just a second) while casting a magic missile for the 5th stack. At this point you should have the spellsteal dmg buff from black hole and 5 stacks so it's just meteor and frost nova them for the burst.
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Ahaha, I didn't even know that arcane dynamo only released at 5 stacks! that makes a lot of sense then. I'll steal that trick if I ever go back to that build.
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On September 28 2014 22:47 Valiver wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2014 01:03 Cascade wrote:On September 27 2014 23:47 Valiver wrote:On September 27 2014 09:35 Cascade wrote:On September 26 2014 23:06 Valiver wrote:On September 26 2014 18:42 Cascade wrote:
How does starpact (uses up all your mana, more damage the more mana you have) work together with power hungry (next spell is cast for free). It still empties my mana pool when I cast star pact with power hungry, but does it do more damage? If you use star pact I think it costs 40 arcane power to cast and then takes up the rest of your resources. Power hungry pays that initial 40 arcane power for you, so you get more bonus damage. That makes sense, thanks. How did you know? I've tried star pact before for fun and I tested it to make sure it works What build did you use? I got critical hits up to half a billion everything included, but don't think I averaged more damage than my disintegrate build, and certainly less crowd control. But it is fun to one-shot champion packs on t5 rifts with two players. Yeah it's a terrible build solo, but was fun to try. It's been awhile but I think the build I did was something like - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#aPQSjN!ZXTY!aZaZacI also tried this build - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#aPYSjN!iaTY!aZcZac to try to get as high a crit as possible but I don't remember what I got to =/
I tried out your build and I totally agree it is rough to do solo. It works pretty well when I play with my wife and her witch doctor pets tank. It doesn't clear the whites as well as my other build but it definitely kills elites faster. I can one shot elites on torment 1 which is hilarious. If you switch the meteor rune to meteor shower it clears the whites really well but you burn through the free casting a lot faster.
What I like about my build was all the DoT as I added in two DoT legendary gems. Two hydras a cheap blizzard and a meteor swarm gave tons of AoE damage but it only worked for solo or teams with CC as the build gives you no CC of your own. I think I'll try a hybrid of your build and mine next.
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/DjS6wp1.png)
had this beauty for about 3 hours then ripped
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wth! :o
gibbeeee pl0x!!
Don't waste that kind of gems on the HC ppl that only destroy them... 
But yeah, I can see how a wow can, ... umm, encourage players to a playstyle that, ... well, ... will lead to certain events... that may not be desirable in hardcore. There, I said it.
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Found my WoW on season Currently on my alt Wiz playing around cold EB to play with friends who started season late and cant really go above T4 anyway.
![[image loading]](http://i60.tinypic.com/2d7wnbo.jpg)
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Just got my Firebirds set!!
A few questions:
1http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/SlkCascade-2516/hero/22556342 what should I improve apart from generally better rolls?
2 I feel really mana starved. Any tricks?
3 thoughts on meteor versus standard hydra?
4 the % damage gems, do they stack multiplicatively with the big elemental-skill-vs elite class of damage buffs?
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On October 04 2014 17:32 Cascade wrote:Just got my Firebirds set!! A few questions: 1http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/SlkCascade-2516/hero/22556342 what should I improve apart from generally better rolls? 2 I feel really mana starved. Any tricks? 3 thoughts on meteor versus standard hydra? 4 the % damage gems, do they stack multiplicatively with the big elemental-skill-vs elite class of damage buffs?
ad 1) b.net profile is bugged in displaying items, so thats pretty much impossible to answer...
ad 2) try to get Cindercoat, that makes huge difference
ad 3) meteor does burst damage, which is not needed with FB build. FB build is about damage over time and kiting, so Hydra wins.
ad 4) it seems so, except BotPowerful which stacks additively with Force weapon and other selfbuffs
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Caldeum1977 Posts
I would say change meteor to hydra and conflagration to evocation. Meteor is probably the reason why you are having mana issues. Hydra adds constant damage for almost no mana and lets you have plenty of mana to keep the area blanketed in blizzard.
As said in the post above Cindercoat is huge for mana problems and also is just a good damage item. A pair of strongarms bracers is needed as well. Black hole + evocation for more uptime on the %dmg buff from the bracers > conflagration by a lot.
You really need to upgrade those legendary gems. The secondary effects give a lot of damage, and the toxin gem procs the shields on corrupted angels to poison damage so you kill those faster.
Beside that it's all as you said: better rolls. Oh and upgrade your topazes if you have the gold for it too, that's a good chunk of int you could get without farming.
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On October 04 2014 17:32 Cascade wrote:Just got my Firebirds set!! A few questions: 1http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/profile/SlkCascade-2516/hero/22556342 what should I improve apart from generally better rolls? 2 I feel really mana starved. Any tricks? 3 thoughts on meteor versus standard hydra? 4 the % damage gems, do they stack multiplicatively with the big elemental-skill-vs elite class of damage buffs?
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/14422562400
everything you need to know is in that thread
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On October 05 2014 04:58 Valiver wrote:
I would say change meteor to hydra and conflagration to evocation. Meteor is probably the reason why you are having mana issues. Hydra adds constant damage for almost no mana and lets you have plenty of mana to keep the area blanketed in blizzard.
As said in the post above Cindercoat is huge for mana problems and also is just a good damage item. A pair of strongarms bracers is needed as well. Black hole + evocation for more uptime on the %dmg buff from the bracers > conflagration by a lot.
You really need to upgrade those legendary gems. The secondary effects give a lot of damage, and the toxin gem procs the shields on corrupted angels to poison damage so you kill those faster.
Beside that it's all as you said: better rolls. Oh and upgrade your topazes if you have the gold for it too, that's a good chunk of int you could get without farming.
Molten Impact cannot cause AP problems unless you have 90+ CDR
People tend to underestimate toxin gem, but I cant really agree with this. Secondary is nice, but no, gem is not important because of 10% DPS or what it does to angels.
GET gem is important because it effectively triples your damage vs trash mobs. Apocalypse deals too low damage, most trash mobs die from toxin gem damage and Apocalypse is used just to proc it, even in mid GRs. And in T6 its by far the most important gem of this spec.
Looking again at your spec Cascade, Id say your priority is to change your weapon to pretty much anything -_- I know people say Furnace is the best weapon in game - and its true - but its still not good enough so that every Furnace roll is better than everything else xD And 3350 DPS furnace with Str is too weak on wiz, even crafted Devastator is going to be much better ^^
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Thanks for all the feedback. I have acted on most of it:
my profile
- changed to hydra
- leveled my gems a bit 
- upped two topazes
- changed furnace to sanctis + firebirds source, allowing me to use magefist.
- Dont have a cindercoat, but I know what I'll be gambling for. If I get a cindercoat, should I dump blackthornes boots to use both magefist and cindercoat?
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On October 05 2014 10:14 Cascade wrote:Thanks for all the feedback. I have acted on most of it: my profile- changed to hydra - leveled my gems a bit - upped two topazes - changed furnace to sanctis + firebirds source, allowing me to use magefist. - Dont have a cindercoat, but I know what I'll be gambling for. If I get a cindercoat, should I dump blackthornes boots to use both magefist and cindercoat?
You're better off crafting a devastator, that axe of sankis is terrible. It has no int and attack speed is useless for firebirds, and on top of that the damage range on a devastator is much higher than that of the sankis. Replace the devastator once you get a decent sun keeper.
After that, gamble gloves and boots, then get a cindercoat and run 6p + cindercoat without an rorg. If you get an int furnace then replace the cindercoat for firebirds chest.
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Ok, used up some 40 forgotten souls and crafted a devastator for 2% more damage, and 5% more toughness (and 2% more fire damage). Small upgrade!
I have all pieces of firebirds, but I don't have a cindercoat, and to be frank I don't have a great alternative for rorg either. :/ I would need an int, cd, cc, socket ring.
but I know what to aim for now. I get a cindercoat, and a good ring (fingers crossed!), then I swap out to 6 piece firebirds with cindercoat and my new ring, and then I'll change my blackthornes belt as well, I guess. I got a Harringtons laying around, is that a good alternative for belts?
thanks for all the help guys.
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Canada8157 Posts
I prefer to do magefist which results in more CD/CC than cindercoat for extra mana reduction. The point of Firebirds is to stack a dot with the most possible DMG (magefist) compared to doing the most damage vs mobs (cindercoat), so IMO magefist > cindercoat
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On October 05 2014 13:29 Jer99 wrote:
I prefer to do magefist which results in more CD/CC than cindercoat for extra mana reduction. The point of Firebirds is to stack a dot with the most possible DMG (magefist) compared to doing the most damage vs mobs (cindercoat), so IMO magefist > cindercoat
You have cc/cd on your firebirds gloves, the only thing you gain from magefists are attack speed, which you don't need. With firebirds gloves you get int/vit/cc/cd, which makes you less squishy, and you can use the cindercoat to make up for the fire % that magefists give, in addition to resource cost reduction. There is literally no reason to use magefists over a cindercoat.
On October 05 2014 13:24 Cascade wrote:
Ok, used up some 40 forgotten souls and crafted a devastator for 2% more damage, and 5% more toughness (and 2% more fire damage). Small upgrade!
I have all pieces of firebirds, but I don't have a cindercoat, and to be frank I don't have a great alternative for rorg either. :/ I would need an int, cd, cc, socket ring.
but I know what to aim for now. I get a cindercoat, and a good ring (fingers crossed!), then I swap out to 6 piece firebirds with cindercoat and my new ring, and then I'll change my blackthornes belt as well, I guess. I got a Harringtons laying around, is that a good alternative for belts?
thanks for all the help guys.
An alternative for belts would be a string of ears until you get a witching hour. And yeah, you just need to find a decent ring. In solo you'd be running unity+soj though.
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doesnt the firebirds tick incrfease with attack speed?
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On October 05 2014 13:56 Cascade wrote:
doesnt the firebirds tick incrfease with attack speed?
Nope, attack speed has no effect on dots. Attack speed doesn't increase the damage on any skills, the only thing it does is allow you to cast faster, which allows you to do more damage, but the actual damage numbers that pop up from your skills don't change from attack speed.
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On October 05 2014 14:06 SyNc` wrote:Show nested quote +On October 05 2014 13:56 Cascade wrote:
doesnt the firebirds tick incrfease with attack speed? Nope, attack speed has no effect on dots. Attack speed doesn't increase the damage on any skills, the only thing it does is allow you to cast faster, which allows you to do more damage, but the actual damage numbers that pop up from your skills don't change from attack speed.
That is fairly shocking... :o
I take it that the ticks still tick at the same interval, so that a weapon with slower attack speed does more dps per second from the dot than a faster with the same dps?
But then I don't understand why I should switch from the furnace. With an attack speed of 0.9, compared to 1.2 of the devastator, the devastator will do 0.9/1.2 = 75% of the damage on the dots, seeing that my sheet dps was only changed a few percent. So even with crap rolls, even giving me 10% less sheet dps, the extremely slow attack speed of the furnace should be worth it, as the dots will be much higher?
btw, rereading the description of the firebirds 6 set bonus, it is really, really unclear what it actually does...
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First (as I said previously) b.net stats are bugged, 2H maces have 0.9 APS no more, its actually 1 APS (you can still find non-magic mace with 0.9 though -_-).
When using 1H you can use FB orb and extra either Cindercoat or Magefist, making it total 40% more fire damage, also 10% CHC on orb and on top of that you get little more intelligence (usually for price of some vitality).
I did some math spells on this before and here are my results:
Furnace (37,1) >> SK (31,4) > Devastator (29,1) > 1,0 APS 2H mace (28,3) > Maximus (27,7) > 1,1 APS 2H staff (25,7)
numbers in brackets (#) are respective damage scores for relative comparison. So perfect Furnace (score: 37,1) for example deals ~18% more damage to elites than perfect SK (score: 31,4). Devastator actually delas about the same damage to white trash as Furnace (=devastator is best weapon with cindercoat for trial runs, highest damage and cheap spells). This comparison also ignores passives such as Maximus fire chains.
All of this is assuming ~8500 Intelligence (higher Intelligence favors 2H weapons), 48% CHC without Source (lower CHC favors 1H weapons, because 10% CHC on Source is more significant) and ~400% CHD including weapon Emerald.
Also perfect Elite/Elemental damage on SoJ, Unity, Bane of Powerful, Bracers, Amulet and Cindercoat (in case of 1H + Orb). Generally non-perfect Elite damage favors Furnace and SK, non-perfect Elemental damage favors Devastator and Maximus, while other weapons remains relatively unaffected - but this one is a bit more complicated.
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EPT
