• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 11:47
CEST 17:47
KST 00:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call8[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3
Community News
New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery!29Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week5Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles2GSTL Returns in 2026!45Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out7
StarCraft 2
General
SC4ALL II: SC2 Player Announcement 6/8 - Maru SC2 best pvp 2026 game hypothesis Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Weekly Cups (August 17-23): Zerg dominate the week Starcraft2 player guess game is Coming~!
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Announcement IntoTheTV X SOOP SC2 League : Weekly & Monthly PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) WORTEX 2026 - Hungarian SC2 Finals Budapest
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 540 Dodge This The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome Mutation # 538 Media Blackout
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion New 3v3 BGH Ladder (and more) on ShieldBattery! [ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Siren's Call Farewell Beloved Starcraft (Youtube Videos) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro24 Group F Escore Tournament - Season 3 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3 [ASL22] Ro24 Group E
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Replay Review Process - What do you do? Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Anyone here play Quakeworld back in the day? Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Dating: How's your luck? Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
The Creator Fan Club MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Violent Games and Crime Rate…
TrAiDoS
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 5528 users

Talent vs Hard Work in StarCraft - Page 2

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
RJBTVYOUTUBE
Profile Joined December 2023
Netherlands1286 Posts
June 17 2024 19:06 GMT
#21
On June 18 2024 03:58 zelevin wrote:
How much does this exaggerate Sea? I don't know much about brood war player lore.

It does and it doesn't. Back then Sea's talent alone was enough to play at the level back then, because the meta was MUCH LESS refined and MUCH LESS optimized. Now with peak optimizations, refinements and such, even with a lot of practice, which he had in 2023 june-2024january, he didn't get close to being a top performer.

Now Soulkey and Rain on the other hand are prime examples of Talent + medium effort.
JDON MY SOUL!
Peeano
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Netherlands5739 Posts
June 17 2024 19:27 GMT
#22
Rain hasn't cared enough anymore in well over a year now. No effort, let alone medium effort to be found there. Also don't forget Light 4-0 Rain, and a bit of a stretch but maybe also don't forget Jaedong 4-0 Rain.

Rain only won golds cuz:
1. He didn't meet Flash.
2. cuz of PvP (and Snow and Mini being chokers).
3. Light didn't know how to play TvP yet.
4. MPL wasn't a regular thing yet.

Rain really is overrated.
FBH #1!
RJBTVYOUTUBE
Profile Joined December 2023
Netherlands1286 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-06-17 20:58:28
June 17 2024 20:56 GMT
#23
On June 18 2024 04:27 Peeano wrote:
Rain hasn't cared enough anymore in well over a year now. No effort, let alone medium effort to be found there. Also don't forget Light 4-0 Rain, and a bit of a stretch but maybe also don't forget Jaedong 4-0 Rain.

Rain only won golds cuz:
1. He didn't meet Flash.
2. cuz of PvP (and Snow and Mini being chokers).
3. Light didn't know how to play TvP yet.
4. MPL wasn't a regular thing yet.

Rain really is overrated.


MPL is a regular thing since 2019 August.
ASL13 Rain beat Soma 4-2, Beat Soulkey 3-2, Beat Light in Ro16 2-1 and Royal 1-0 Ro24 was Action 1-0 and Bishop 1-0.

He bombed in Ro24s in ASL16 R(vs Calm & Soulkey) and 17(vs barracks & RoyaL).

To get a general idea on his performance extend the match history on his ELOBOARD. He's doing well when he's active, and does semi-well when he's not as active. Sea as a comparison didn't even do half as well.

https://eloboard.com/men/bbs/board.php?bo_table=bj_list&wr_id=39

[image loading]


JDON MY SOUL!
NoobSkills
Profile Joined August 2009
United States1603 Posts
June 17 2024 22:19 GMT
#24
On June 14 2024 18:48 JoinTheRain wrote:
Nothing new, it's like the saying "You can't make a whistle out of every tree." I mean, no matter how much I train or like basketball and enjoy playing it, no amount of basketball training, best coaches, conditions and all, none of it will prevent LeBron James from crushing me 100% every game.


Bugsy was 5 foot 3 and did well in the NBA. Sure natural talent and some genetic advantages can do somethings for you, but your dedication can make up for a lot more than people think. The difference largely being that lebron not only has a physical advantage, but he does practice a lot as well. So, no if you were bugsy you might get beat by him, but he beats everyone else as well too. But that doesn't mean you couldn't make a difference in other ways.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 8h 13m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
LamboSC2 301
Trap 16
SHIN 15
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 57480
Calm 5486
EffOrt 1115
Shuttle 1075
Soma 670
Light 606
Rush 344
ZerO 297
Stork 279
Snow 256
[ Show more ]
hero 146
ggaemo 146
Yoon 97
Liquid`Ret 70
910 65
Dewaltoss 65
Mini 61
Sexy 35
Terrorterran 24
zelot 22
Aegong 21
soO 14
Dota 2
qojqva4377
Dendi2396
Pyrionflax353
Counter-Strike
fl0m3738
x6flipin605
pashabiceps380
Other Games
Gorgc4002
hiko892
B2W.Neo872
Liquid`RaSZi805
crisheroes662
FrodaN403
Beastyqt366
Hui .176
DeMusliM175
Liquid`VortiX135
Mew2King100
KnowMe80
QueenE58
Trikslyr24
ZerO(Twitch)14
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 14
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile141
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2118
League of Legends
• Nemesis2757
• TFBlade443
Other Games
• Shiphtur178
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
8h 13m
Escore
18h 13m
IntoTheTV X SOOP
19h 13m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 10h
GSL
1d 19h
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
GSL
4 days
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 22: Qualifier 1
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
META DYMY #4

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 2
RSL Revival: Season 6
Light Tournament 2026
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026

Upcoming

BSL 2026 LAN: Kraków
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Calamity Invitational
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.