Map Information Name: Turbine 1.01 Tileset: Structure (Badlands) Players: Three (3) Starting: 2, 6, 10 Size: 128x128 Creator: Minerals
Resources Main Base: 8x1500 1x749 + 1x5000 Side Yard: 7x1500 + 1x5000 Mineral Front Yard: 7x1500 "3rd Gas" Multi: 7x1200 + 1x4000(gas)
Concept This map is based on top of a very large warehouse structure on planet Mar Sara. The vision is to be able to expand clockwise or counter clockwise with the same distance and scouting units will automatically walk outside dirt path. The "3rd bases" are reduced to 1200 + 4000 because so many multi on top of ramp and forcing players to continue to expand and eat around the map. Yes, there may be some positional variety involving spawning in bottom position - but since the Main base and Side yard are "one base" then the positional variety is balanced out.
Features -Pathing de-bug so units will properly walk on map and Reavers will not have hard time shooting in battle. -Scouting units follow outer circle around center of map with smaller ramps. -Big armies move through center area and big ramp. -Main base has "pocket" for unit control behind minerals. -Front yard sim city is easy for all races. -All players can properly block all entrances with 3-4 pylons.
Player Notes -Neutral Creep Colony: If zerg player spawns, Neutral creep colony will create creep near ramp for defense structures. -Yellow "Grid" (center) = Unbuildable. -Dirt pathway = Buildable. -Neutral main base has "X" blocking efficient mining because of two multi above one ramp (same as (3)Transistor).
Rushing Distance Ramp to ramp = ~25 seconds (Polypoid = ~27 seconds) Short rush is okay since the side yard is easy to control inside of main base up one ramp and easy to make wall.
UPDATES 1.0 --> 1.01 Widened all ramps in center by ~4 tiles.
개념 이지도는 Mar Sara 행성에있는 매우 큰 창고 구조를 기반으로합니다. 비전은 동일한 거리로 시계 방향 또는 시계 반대 방향으로 확장 할 수 있으며 정찰 유닛은 자동으로 먼지 경로 밖으로 걸어 갈 것입니다. "3 번 기지"는 1200 + 4000으로 줄었습니다. 경사로 위에 너무 많은 멀티가 있고 플레이어가 계속해서지도를 확장하고 먹도록하기 때문입니다. 예, 하단 위치에서 스폰을 포함하는 위치에 따라 약간의 다양성이있을 수 있습니다.하지만 메인베이스와 사이드 야드가 "1베이스"이기 때문에 위치 다양성이 균형을 이룹니다.
기능 -디버그 경로 지정으로 유닛이지도에서 제대로 걸을 수 있고 리버가 전투에서 사격하는 데 어려움을 겪지 않습니다. -추적 유닛은 더 작은 램프가있는지도 중앙의 바깥 쪽 원을 따릅니다. -큰 군대가 중앙 지역과 큰 경사로를 통해 이동합니다. -메인베이스에는 광물 뒤의 유닛 제어를위한 "포켓"이 있습니다. -앞마당 시뮬레이션 도시는 모든 레이스에서 쉽습니다. -모든 플레이어는 3-4 개의 철탑으로 모든 입구를 올바르게 차단할 수 있습니다.
플레이어 노트 -중립 크립 식민지 : 저그 플레이어가 스폰되면 중립 크립 식민지는 방어 구조물을 위해 경사로 근처에 크립을 생성합니다. ** -노란색 "격자"(가운데) = 제작 불가. -먼지 경로 = 건설 가능. -중립 메인베이스는 하나의 램프 위에 두 개의 멀티 멀티 ((3) 트랜지스터와 동일)로 인해 효율적인 채굴을 차단하는 "X"가 있습니다. *
돌진 거리 램프로 램프 = ~ 25 초 (Polypoid = ~ 27 초) 사이드 야드는 한 경사로 위로 메인베이스 내부를 제어하기 쉽기 때문에 이것은 큰 문제가 아닙니다
I love the look of the map, I'm just worried it's a little too chokey. The mineral only might make things a little hard to move around, and the small ramps for scouts I think should be made bigger.
Here's a suggestion to open up the map a little bit more: make the large central ramps one tile larger, make the side ramps for scouts 1-2 tiles larger. Change the mineral only base locations... one suggestion could be to flip the mineral layout so it's tucked up against the main/natural high ground, and change the terrain so that it's not quite as easy to defend. You already have an in-base natural, no need to make the 3rd more constricted and hard to attack imo.
Blue arrow: move the minerals. Red lines: widen the ramps. White X: remove the terrain. Purple circle: I think you can keep these if you move the minerals, still helps a bit with defense but opens the center.
On February 01 2021 05:03 FlaShFTW wrote: I love the look of the map, I'm just worried it's a little too chokey. The mineral only might make things a little hard to move around, and the small ramps for scouts I think should be made bigger.
Here's a suggestion to open up the map a little bit more: make the large central ramps one tile larger, make the side ramps for scouts 1-2 tiles larger. Change the mineral only base locations... one suggestion could be to flip the mineral layout so it's tucked up against the main/natural high ground, and change the terrain so that it's not quite as easy to defend. You already have an in-base natural, no need to make the 3rd more constricted and hard to attack imo.
Blue arrow: move the minerals. Red lines: widen the ramps. White X: remove the terrain. Purple circle: I think you can keep these if you move the minerals, still helps a bit with defense but opens the center.
Imo I'd want to see the map play tested with the mineral only as placed in the OP rather than default to a configuration we see frequently (against the main). I don't think the point of these efforts is to be conservative about configuration and map dynamics, especially on a first release.
why the smaller ramps in the middle? How can protoss beat terran mech? It's hard enough being able to contest any base at all, but there's literally no way of beating a terran out on the map with movement so constricted.
The map looks very nice, i like the ideas from Flash but first i'd like to see some games on map from OP too.
On February 02 2021 17:24 abuse wrote: why the smaller ramps in the middle? How can protoss beat terran mech? It's hard enough being able to contest any base at all, but there's literally no way of beating a terran out on the map with movement so constricted.
On February 02 2021 17:24 abuse wrote: why the smaller ramps in the middle? How can protoss beat terran mech? It's hard enough being able to contest any base at all, but there's literally no way of beating a terran out on the map with movement so constricted.
What do you mean? Either 1a2a3a or Carriers
you can't 1a2a3a and expect to kill anything on a map like this.
On February 02 2021 17:24 abuse wrote: why the smaller ramps in the middle? How can protoss beat terran mech? It's hard enough being able to contest any base at all, but there's literally no way of beating a terran out on the map with movement so constricted.
Yeah I'm a little concerned about how hard it will be to push over the ramps. The sides are impossible, and the center is really constricted. If you prefer a tighter center ramp area, I recommend then adding another intermediate ramp between the center ramps and the small ramps on the side, sort of like a longinus style where the middle offers many counter attacks. I'd like to see some top players submit some replays on this layout, and maybe have OP create a second map and have some playtest with a more open map.
The double-wide ramps (smaller center ramps) seem to move 24 dragoons just fine, so not sure about constriction or immobility. Have you played some games on the map or are you basing off of the image? So far in my test games I have not felt P<T when T holds center.
On February 01 2021 05:03 FlaShFTW wrote: I love the look of the map, I'm just worried it's a little too chokey. The mineral only might make things a little hard to move around, and the small ramps for scouts I think should be made bigger.
Here's a suggestion to open up the map a little bit more: make the large central ramps one tile larger, make the side ramps for scouts 1-2 tiles larger. Change the mineral only base locations... one suggestion could be to flip the mineral layout so it's tucked up against the main/natural high ground, and change the terrain so that it's not quite as easy to defend. You already have an in-base natural, no need to make the 3rd more constricted and hard to attack imo.
Blue arrow: move the minerals. Red lines: widen the ramps. White X: remove the terrain. Purple circle: I think you can keep these if you move the minerals, still helps a bit with defense but opens the center.
Something I just thought of:
If the ramps were wider, the rush distance would be way to short. If the min only multi was against the wall then it would create an annoying pathing issue for armies casually moving around.
I think rush distance is a small price to pay and in fact is actually a welcome change considering the free 2nd main, allowing for rushes to also be effective.
if you're that worried, then there's always neutral buildings like temples or eggs to place on routes you don't want to be used too early.
On February 04 2021 18:55 abuse wrote: I think rush distance is a small price to pay and in fact is actually a welcome change considering the free 2nd main, allowing for rushes to also be effective.
if you're that worried, then there's always neutral buildings like temples or eggs to place on routes you don't want to be used too early.
I agree with this comment. If you're concerned about rush distance being maybe 2 seconds faster with widened side ramps, then just add path blockers like generators at the top of the ramp or something. I think that would be a pretty simple fix all things considered.
Minerals, it's clear you are very much in love with your map design and seem very against changing it. I find it hard to believe you have an easy time moving 24 dragoons through the center. Are you walking them in a straight line, or are you getting them to be very spread out while walking through? Please provide some replays so we can see how the map is playing out, that's what I want to know.
Also your point of pathing issues with the minerals against the main isnt really an issue. You already might have that issue if you're moving your army back and forth around the mineral only already.
As for the rushing distance: 25gs is what Dies Iræ currently has, also with a backdoor/in-base natural layout. When it had only 21gs shortest rushing distance (the same as natural choke to natural choke on FS, so that's pretty short) players were complaining about its being too short. Consider that with the main in front rallying and timings are actually quiote a bit faster. Ringing Bloom has 31gs on close position, but that's probably a bit too much, considering the amount of corner cutting seen in ASL. That being said, a double width ramp on the outside would hardly influence rushing distances. Middle ramps could probably be extended by 2 without much of a problem. and the wall behind the mineral only could be extended to ensure proper unit pathing.
Every one who claims units getting stuck on mining workers in an expansion wouldn't be a big deal probably hasn't seen it being a big deal because map makers usually know how to avoid its happening… Same with using neutral buildings to semi-block a choke. It is wont to cause more of unit movement hick-up than it is probably worth.
I like standard maps. This map and in general from what I see from other foreign map makers is they seem to think every map needs to be truly unique and special. This is a lot harder to make work then just making standard maps that feel great to play on and often just leads to frustation when it comes to actually playing the map.
Personally I am hoping and looking forward to the establishment of a BW map making Twitch and Youtube channel for map related content (e.g., individual or collective mapping sessions, basic or advanced tutorials, showmatches on new maps with mappers and others casting, map contests, etc.). I believe the organized section of the foreign map making community is working towards such a goal which would be fantastic. Keep up the great work gentlemen.
There is another map test tour today at 11pm KST (+4.75 hours i think?). Not sure what the map pool is. I think you can view here https://bj.afreecatv.com/luckycontrol/
Minerals has shown that hard work, passion and collaboration can get you far in SC mapping in a relatively short amount of time. Hoping any new or inactive veteran mappers out there take notice and are inspired by that to join the wonderful Brood War mapping community