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how come this MOTS got so popular? dont we got enough maps already? T_T I guess you mapmakers think it's nice and a good opotunity to show off your maps, but they will never be accepted as official maps (if they dont have a VERY good balance, not like satter/chameleon).
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"(4)Origo_Hills" and "(4)Home of the swarm" look nice - really nice.
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I also like home of the swarm. Interesting idea in putting a neutral comp player in there to mix things up, although It may give zergs advantage because of the creep. Would be interesting to see things played out here
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On April 17 2006 08:42 ZpuX wrote: how come this MOTS got so popular? dont we got enough maps already? T_T I guess you mapmakers think it's nice and a good opotunity to show off your maps, but they will never be accepted as official maps (if they dont have a VERY good balance, not like satter/chameleon). in one way, we have enough maps already. but they fall into a few categories: (1) maps that are imba (2) maps boring or similar weak versions of good maps (3) maps that are good, unique, necessary.
i think the goal of MOTS is to get more of that category (3) maps. there aren't as many as you think. we have too many (1) and (2)'s.
i think you are probably right about satter/chameleon, but it's worth a try... if we started admitting to yourself how few category 3 maps we have, then the role of MOTS would make more sense.....
this issue deserves its own topic though.. trying to figure out how many playable, popular maps are really out there. it's very debatable. every map seems to have its haters, so we should keep searching. bw keeps changing. many great maps aren't even playable anymore..
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MOTS can not be 2 or 3 player maps. They must be at least four player maps for purposes of 2v2 players as well.
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Awoken demons has a nice idea... I find it balanced... only the tileset sucks.
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howabout for the new MOTS a map that we see in progaming alot but just havent played alot of, so to encourage diversity in maps howabout 815 III, its a new style, though not entirely unfamiliar, and would introduce a new style of play for most players.
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why on earth is a mots needed? if you really really want to encourage people to play bad maps just have one as motw each week.
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yea, 3 good maps as motw's is abit too much atm imo :D will be times when there are 3 really bad maps, or 2 bad maps and 1 ok map, which has some ibalance in some mu --V
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On April 17 2006 11:25 hrmM wrote: MOTS can not be 2 or 3 player maps. They must be at least four player maps for purposes of 2v2 players as well. i am only considering 1v1. imo 2v2 should have its own map pool and not be connected to any MOTS/MOTW... we should not have our 1v1 MOTS/MOTW limited because of gay little 2v2
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Those maps look pretty cool, but what does MOTS mean?
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On April 17 2006 14:35 rushz0rz wrote: Those maps look pretty cool, but what does MOTS mean? I have absolutely no idea but I'd guess Map Of The Season
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On April 17 2006 14:35 rushz0rz wrote: Those maps look pretty cool, but what does MOTS mean? It means Map of the Session, this map will give for the games played on it at http://pgtour.net/ 150% Points and will be a whole Session MOT"W" instead of one or two weeks.
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(4)Sacred Grounds is my favorite one.
Oh wait, I'm the author of that map :D
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United States5262 Posts
Sacred Grounds, however make the bases a little bigger and put some trees near the wall on the INSIDE. If Terran tries to tank outside, the units inside the base then they get trees for cover and not the other way around. iono, just an idea.
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United States5262 Posts
I really like Aarklash and Citadel of Adun too.
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Russian Federation7 Posts
Hmm, 70% of maps are picked by the picture, right? Citadel of Adun. TvZ? T is unbeatable until he is a 2-day newbie.
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Russian Federation7 Posts
Zerg FE on Maze in the Forest is impossible, P>Z, T>Z for sure. High Enough - 2 ways to attack expo. That always was a problem in such maps. Do you remember Martian Cross? In Chains has a very open expansion, so getting 2nd gas will be very hard + all expos are siegeable. HotS also has open natural. Terran easily can run with marines behind the minline. To properly defend his 1st expo WITHOUT GAS(!), zerg player must have shit load of sunkens + lings army. Economic is crashed. Origo Hills is good. Well tested, with original gameplay. With little rebuilding it may become a new hit. Awoken demons are also good. But you need to place sunkens on the minline of FE. Rines could move down the cliff and shoot minerals. Goons and ST too ^^ Warrior of Ice - good choice. Nice design, well placed expos. Ode to the sun may be imbalanced in TvZ because of the most expos are on the lowground. Time is runnung out. Can't say nothing about this one. Everything is questionable here, but the concept is great. Aarklash with some positional balancing may become the best here. It just need some cliff fixing.
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i'd play on: (4)Aarklash (2)Ode to the sun (2)Warrior of Ice (2)Awoken Demons (4)Sacred Grounds 1.2
the others suck in one way or another
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On April 18 2006 03:56 Spitfire[a2] wrote: Hmm, 70% of maps are picked by the picture, right? Citadel of Adun. TvZ? T is unbeatable until he is a 2-day newbie. mad none of your maps were here? i know i'm not the best player, and many of these maps could be improved. but i tried to find maps that offerred gameplay that popular maps don't and might be balancable. i know i've missed many (i didn't look at your maps yet, but i know they're great, but too conventional for a MOTS, we already have pro maps that play like your maps do, so what's the point?). but you also sound like a zerg player in your judgements, like you want everything perfect for zerg, maybe.
called good (4)Aarklash "with some positional balancing may become the best here, just needs some cliff (2)Awoken Demons "but you need to place sunkens on the minline of FE" sdpgposd would play on it. Arcanis says it's balanced. (2)Warrior of Ice sdpgposd would play on it. fixing" sdpgposd would play on it. jkillashark like this. (4)Origo_Hills sdpgposd must think this sucks. proTOSS[GER] says it looks really nice.
called imba (2)Ode to the sun "might be imba TvZ because most expos are lowground" sdpgposd would play on it. is this really imba? (3)Maze in Forest "P>Z, T>Z, Zerg FE impossible" sdpgposd must think this sucks. map is too tight maybe(?), but Z can get nat reasonably can't they, and 2 entrances/cliffs favors Z..? (2)High Enough "2 ways to attack expo, a problem like Martian Cross" sdpgposd must think this sucks. but good players liked Martian Cross fine... (2)InChains "very open expansion, getting 2nd gas is too hard. all expos siegable." sdpgposd must think this sucks. if the expo was fixed, and it had a gas, then what? (4)Home of the swarm "open natural. terran easily runs marines behind mineral line. zerg needs too many sunkens and only has 1 gas." sdpgposd must think this sucks. proTOSS[GER] says it looks really nice. if the expo was fixed, and had a gas, then what? (4)Time is running out "everything questionable here, but concept is great" sdpgposd must think this sucks. can anyone really judge this kind of map yet?
what about... (4)Citadel Of Adun2.0 sdpgposd must think this sucks. why? jkillashark like this. need more info (4)Sacred Grounds 1.2 sdpgposd would play on it. jkillashark like this. (2)Doughnut sdpgposd must think this sucks. why? need more info (4)Mystic Valley 1.1 sdpgposd must think this sucks. why? need more info
sdpgposd, Arcanis, jkillashark, proTOSS[GER], Spitfire[a2], could you elaborate more to fill in this picture? what are the problems, and the strengths?
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Well, some points:
1. the neutral units make for fairly slow / boring gameplay as well as making it more difficult to assault or flank the enemy - this includes units like OLs, creep cols and all the special neutrals too. 2. Some of them i didnt like because there was no clear 'natural' expand 3. The map Citadel of adun i didnt like, im thinking of the old map 'parralel something or other' which was well-known for being heavily imbalanced. Two gases in main i really dislike sorry. (think mass templar) 4. I wouldnt play on 'time is running out' because of all the neutral buildings. Sure it looks cute and the idea is cute but its very impractical for a smooth game. 5. I'd play Ode of the sun because it looks like a lot of fun. I dont think it would be particularly imbalanced tvz, possibly more difficult vs tanks and so on, however you would have to use the ramps to get units behind their units to flank most likely. Which is why i think the map creator made two ramps in the center and one nearer the natural.. Pretty balanced. 6. At first i thought warrior of ice looked quite imbalance but after a bit more thought i figured it seemed ok to play on. 7. I dont like 'high enough' because of the bridges and ramps which lead out of the 'main areas' which the player can be happy with till mid/late game when he has to expand or attack big time.. 8. Maze in Forest is questionable.. i dislike that its a 3 player map and that, bunker rush would own here vs z imo :| 9. Awoken demons is a pretty cute map. The special doodads? actually do work pretty well here and the map overall is nice. Plus, its a 1v1 map, they're awesome ! 10. I dislike orego hills because of the fact the main is so small, you have to really build on the lower levels... im thinking this is pretty bad vs certain drop situations (its harder to get units upto defend) and the expansions can be raped by tanks. Its not terrible, just i know i wouldnt prefer to play on it. 11. InChains isnt terrible i just dislike the fact its so open. 12. I dislike home of the swarm because of all the neutral shit basically. If i wanted to flank on that the AI would most likely fuck up unless all those neutral buildings were removed TT Its just the little things on this map that piss me off, for example the cerebrates @ expansion 13. Sacred Grounds is damn cute, it looks very balanced and i like that i can fast expand as zerg and theres plenty of space in the middle (with walls). The only thing i dislike about it is how wide it is around the expansions... 14. I dislike doughnut in general, i'd still play on it if i had to but i wouldnt choose to play on it. 15. I dislike mystic valley because its too open. I can imagine having a terran take those cliffs and camp outside main with m&m being pretty annoying. I probably wouldnt mind playing this map though, but again i wouldnt pick it.
Sorry for the quick rap up @ the end, have to go now ;o
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and I'd play only on Korean pro-maps, sry -.-;;
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id play on (4)Aarklash (2)Ode to the sun (2)Warrior of Ice (4)Mystic Valley 1.1
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Russian Federation7 Posts
Muntol, I'm not mad And I talked about Z only because this is the first things came up to my mind. That's just example. However, I'm toss player. Maybe I was wrong about Ode to the Sun, I didn't play it yet. Maze In The Forest. FE is almost a auto death for Z here. The nats are not safe at all. They are siegeable. That's a big minus. Also you can run with zealots//rines into the mainbase or behind the mineral line - zerg just won't build tons of sunkens (he won't have enough money) to protect all important positions. What do we get? Imbalanced ZvP//ZvT beginning, especially ZvT, because of speedling strat in ZvP. What about other maps? Every map should have at least one thing - safe FE possibility for Zerg players. Why? How many times have you seen Zerg playing only in the mainbase without additional resources and winning the game? Not pro zergs, but regular players, like me or you? Not more than 2 or 3. Because zerg's first units are just weaker than others. Prove me wrong. This thing is essential for creating a really balanced map without limited possibilities for any race.
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most of these maps look really boring for these reasons 1. too big, there are too many macro maps 2. too lt-esque, nothing can re-create the balance of lt, and its occasional moderatley intersesting games 3. wierd ways to get to your opponent
howabout maps like RHIII that can create a micro style game rather than a macro one, most lame attempts to make a macro map like the ones i saw on this thread end up blowing, I hate to break the news but luna is boring, and so is most 4 corner maps. why should we be limited to boring macro maps. lets take the current pgt map pack, and I will pick out ones that are gay macro maps that are boring and most likely a takeoff of lt. 1. Gaia is the worlds lamest takeoff of lt, its about as lame as all of those takeoffs of startrek like battlestar galactica, and other combinations of words like andromeda, star, and battle. In other words there are too many 2. Chameleon, if you rotate it a bit, but keep the islands in the same spot you have lost temple. 3. Nostalgia is just too similar to gaia, I know its 4 corners, but its so gaia-esque Now for boring 4 corner maps, that all are basicly the same, and invoke the same boring macro games that end up getting really boring 1.Arcadia and Azalea thats alot of expansions (not so much in azalea), pretty easily defended, and all fairly close, sunkens and mutas should win the game economically, in other words lame. 2. R-Point, zerg now gets 2 naturals with gas, way to be balanced, and great job on making games even longer. 3. Luna, boring, old, not going to change 4. Sin Cultivation Period, the koreans in order to balance out one of the most imbalanced maps ever decided to take a mineral patch off. Wow, terran now completley sucks on the map, I dont think so. Tho T mirror on that map can be interesting, and sometimes PvZ, it sucks for everything else. 5. Not sure about The Eye. Havent played nor seen enough of it to tell if it will end up any good. And now finally for the interesting maps 1. RHIII only 3 bases, enough expansions for decently lengthed games, but that doesnt happen alot, lots of good micro for RHIII. 2. Paranoid andriod, this map has had atleast one epic battle on it, by that I mean the one where xellos gets his eyeballs raped out, very interesting setup. 3. Neo Forte, 4 corners, but the way the bases are set up it can be pretty interesting. box within a box for the bases, also since you cant build in the middle it makes PvT a pretty good matchup. 4. Baek-do bla bla bla, bad name, but looks cool, should be very interesting, and some micro for once. 5. ROV, TvT can be pretty slow, but most other stuff is pretty cool
So should the next MOTS be another boring, macro based, takeoff of LT, or can it be interesting for once? Everyone gets all paranoid about very slight inbalances so they go for boring takeoffs of lt. so what about a micro based map for the next MOTS, I hope im not alone in thinking to myself that chameleon sucks, and so does most of the season 8 map pack
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United States4258 Posts
I like the swarm idea one, with the creep there could make things interesting.
But overall my favorite would have to be the Awoken Demons. We need more lava/ash maps.
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United States5262 Posts
Okay first off, I would like to say I DO play PGT albeitly not for very long so I'll try to help with choosing the MotS. I am also a Terran player but I'll try not to biased in my comments. Chameleon, although it has good ideas, just has a few too many bugs with it so it seems like it was picked a little hastily.
(4)Aarklash: I think this is probably my favorite map out of the group. Why? I really like that little mineral patch leading to the cliff over the second gas natural. How many minerals is it? I think it should be like 160 minerals? Friend and more likely foe can take advantage of that cliff, but if friend decides to invest the time in mining the 160 or x amount of minerals, it could become safer. Terran won't be able to wall, but since the entrances are so far from each other it's okay. Zerg, I think, can take the first gas natural and defend too easily. I think for balance issues, one of the first two naturals should have their gas taken out OR open up the first naturals a little bit more. Arcadia shelters the first two naturals way TOO much and gets easily defended by Zerg. However, PvT might be a headache for the P. The center is a little bit below enough space for Protoss maneuvers. I think that the hourglass shaped cliffs at 12 and 6 should have an open space inbetween.
(4)Citadel of Adun 2.0: Hmmm, after a second and much closer look at this. There is 12 minerals per base and 2 geysers! Instead of having an abudant amount of resources that might invoke a macro war. How about a LACK of resources? Try putting 9 minerals and 1 geyser to make one base play a little stronger. But no more. There are not many naturals in this map, which I (fear, hahaaha yeah right) might invoke a MICRO war, something that today's macro trend Starcraft is slowly putting out of business. The huge space in the middle is great for maneuvers. 7 oclock looks like it has the hardest time to get an expo. 10 and 4 can hit the gas of the gas natural with a siege tank. But 1 and 7 is left without that ability.
(4)Time Is Running Out: I do not have much experience or knowledge how neutra buildings affect the game, all I know it usually is a big plus for Zerg. Zerg will probably like this map a lot. If Zerg plays a mean 3 hatch, it will be hard for that neutra temple leading to the main to be taken advantage of by another race. Hatchery at the natural and hatchery in front of the temple. Protoss looks as if it might have a real pain on this map. But remember, I'm not too sure how neutra buildings affect the balance of the game.
(2)Ode to the Sun: After a more in depth look. This map looks like it could really be something. It looks like there would be really big battles in the center. This map appears to be a game of control. A lot of the map division could be where you take your first and second expansions. I think taking the ramp natural could result in a diagonal slice. If you take 12 and 6 first, it would be a top vs bottom map control battle. Bones to pick with, the ramps leading to the center (next to 2 and 8 gas naturals) could be just made into one big ramp. This could help Protoss flank Terran setups in the center. With the new tools, the ramp at 2 could be pointed northwest. Zerg might have a little trouble with getting expos late game. But otherwise it seems very balanced. Probably my 2nd favorite map in this pack.
(2)Warrior of Ice: I don't recall saying I liked this map. As a general rule, ice maps aren't really used cause it's killer on the eyes. So it might be nice of the mapmaker to put some green on there. I think it is pretty well balanced except a little too Terran friendly. The islands in the corner could be made a little bigger. It would be too easy for Terran to attack those islands. Maybe make the walls a little thicker around the mains? I think it's too easy to flank the mains. It's about just as long as going up the middle. There has to be more of an investment of time to get a flank attack to the main. I do like the flank ramp to the main, but maybe make it like an 815 ramp, you know? Like only infantry, zerglings, hydras, zealots, and peons can go through. Right now I'm thinking T>Z, Z<P, P<T. Make a nonpassable terrain obstruction to the naturals.
(2)High Enough: I don't think I like this map too much. It'll turn into more of a macro game. 2 expos seem to be secured so easily. Especially for Terran. Protoss will be whining cause Zerg 3 hatch players build have 3 expos to 1 Protoss base. The natural distributions were done so poorly I think. The two naturals in the center of the map will be of utterly no use. It would never be safe enough to be run from there. Terrans can just hit up this imbalanced map.
(3)Maze in Forest: Interesting name since there's NO TREES. Zergs will have hell defending their gas natural. I think Protoss will like this map. However Zergs will hate this map, and there are quite a few Zergs at PGT, this map ain't happenin either.
Dang, I just ate all you can eat sushi, so I'm really lethargic rightna. I'll finish this later muntol.
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(4)Origo_Hills (4)Home of the swarm (4)Sacred Grounds 1.2 (4)Mystic Valley 1.1
Seems decent.
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Heh... someone likes SummerSky's maps . But hey, I love SummerSky's maps, so I definitely don't disagree with you.
My choices out of those are: 1. Ode to the Sun 2. Maze In Forest/Awoken Demons 3. Sacred Grounds
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On April 18 2006 06:56 PLuto.ru wrote: and I'd play only on Korean pro-maps, sry -.-;; 2
and we have tons of good maps...and different maps...
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trying to keep track of the support and feedback here... to form a consensus so far, i guess:
pretty sure (4)Aarklash "with some positional balancing may become the best here, just needs some cliff fixing" sdpgposd would play on it. jkillashark like this (his favorite).. Mr.SeXpIsToLs would play this. (2)Ode to the sun "might be imba TvZ because most expos are lowground" (might be wrong, not sure) sdpgposd would play on it (balanced?). Mr.SeXpIsToLs would play this. jkillashark like this (his 2nd pick). epidion likes it (1st choice). (2)Awoken Demons "but you need to place sunkens on the minline of FE" sdpgposd would play on it. Arcanis says it's balanced. This is WireFrame's pick. epidion likes it (2nd choice). (4)Sacred Grounds 1.2 sdpgposd would play on it (but expansions are too wide?). jkillashark like this. StarOfDust likes it. epidion likes it (4th choice). (4)Origo_Hills sdpgposd must think this sucks (main is too small, would have to build on low ground... duh?). proTOSS[GER] says it looks really nice. StarOfDust likes it. (2)Warrior of Ice sdpgposd would play on it (looks balanced). Mr.SeXpIsToLs would play this. jkillashark is skeptical about the balance (T>Z, P>Z, T>P, corners easily attacked by T, but otherwise well balanced?) (4)Citadel Of Adun2.0 sdpgposd must think this sucks (reminds him of parallel something, is worried about mass templars). why? jkillashark like this (says could be micro war to get expos, but 10/4 can get gas of nat with siege, unlike 1/7. needs fixing). need more info
unsure (4)Time is running out "everything questionable here, but concept is great" sdpgposd must think this sucks (he hates neutral buildings). jkillashark thinks these kinds of maps seem to favor Zerg. But wouldn't this basically play out like an island map? Other races will FE too, Z might even be at a disadvantage... (2)InChains "very open expansion, getting 2nd gas is too hard. all expos siegable." sdpgposd must think this sucks (too open). if the expo was fixed, and it had a gas, then what? (4)Home of the swarm "open natural. terran easily runs marines behind mineral line. zerg needs too many sunkens and only has 1 gas." sdpgposd must think this sucks (he hates neutral buildings). proTOSS[GER] says it looks really nice. if the expo was fixed, and had a gas, then what? WireFrame finds this interesting. StarOfDust likes it. (3)Maze in Forest "P>Z, T>Z, Zerg FE impossible" sdpgposd must think this sucks (dislikes 3 player maps, terran bunker rush owns Z here?). map is too tight maybe(?), but Z can get nat reasonably can't they, and 2 entrances/cliffs favors Z..? Z expo def weaker than on some maps, not fit for lower Z's maybe. NATS ARE SIEGABLE, big big minus. "Imbalanced ZvP//ZvT beginning, especially ZvT, because of speedling strat in ZvP." jkillashark says Zerg will hate this map, P will like it. Zergs can't defend gas natural... epidion likes it (2nd choice). (2)High Enough "2 ways to attack expo, a problem like Martian Cross" sdpgposd must think this sucks (mid/lategame all the exits to main areas are bad). but good players liked Martian Cross fine... jkillashark worries this would be a macro map (2 expos secured so easily, P will whine against Zerg, Terran will be brtual, naturals in center are useless).
what about... (2)Doughnut sdpgposd must think this sucks (dislikes it but would play it). why? need more info (4)Mystic Valley 1.1 sdpgposd must think this sucks (would play it but wouldn't pick it, worries about terran taking the cliffs). Mr.SeXpIsToLs would play this. StarOfDust likes it.why? need more info
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United States5262 Posts
I said that Citadel of Adun 2.0 should get rid of so many resources in the main. Instead of 12 minerals and 2 geysers, 9 minerals and 1 geyser is far better.
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United States5262 Posts
As in resources need to be drastically fixed.
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Citadel of Adun 2.0 may be imbalanced, but I'm thinking you haven't even understood the concept of the map at all. It's not a money map. It's a ground Paradoxxx; your nat is inside your main, but then you don't have an easy nat. Who that actually favors is anyone's guess. We all assume it favored Zerg, and it ended up being P>Z IIRC. The question is whether Zerg, getting 2nd base only slightly better than his opponent, can get enough off a 3rd base and then go on to gain the advantage 3 base vs 2. Typically, no. But there is a low amount of minerals for 2 bases, which shifts the favor back towards zerg. So at least for me, it isn't as simple as you've made it so far. You're comparing CoA to Luna for christsakes...
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actually, the neutral buildings and units in Home Of The Swarm don't cause any trouble. See them as doodads. units do not attack them without the explicit command (a+leftclick). The reason for the neutral units is balancing in PvZ. the idea was that a) only protoss can use them at all and b) you hardly make dark archon in PvP or PvT (and this is really a RARE case). but in PvZ, Dark Archons are an option. So, as most people say PvZ is uneven (not necessarily unbalanced), those units could give a boost to protoss. no big one, but a little boost, because if you tech to DAs you can use maelstrom to strengthen your army with the neutral units. that is the plan. there need some tests to be done, however. especially the gasless natural can cause problems.
IF ONE WANTS TO PLAY ON ONE OF THOSE LISTED MAPS, GO AHEAD! THAT IS WHAT HAS TO BE DONE IN THE FIRST PLACE. then you can also give balance- and replayfeedback at www.broodwarmaps.net
(ps: InChains has not been tested at all yet, it is more a study than a competitive map. i am not even sure if pathing works OK from all positions. so don't consider it having ANY chance^^)
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I think this is a nice list of innovative maps you picked
Though I don't think you can consider Citadel of Adun balanced by any means. Zerg rules everything around us on this map, especially ZvP, but also ZvT. Look, the other races would need to play some kind of fast expo stuff to be able to gather minerals normally, while zerg will need a secound hatch anyway.
On home of the swarm: I agree the naturals are quite open, in ZvT zerg will have a pretty hard time securing everything with sunken. Also I am not sure if the natural should stay gasless, tell me what you think would be best balance wise. In PvT, I think Toss has an advantage right now, maybe making the natural easier to defend would help too.
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thanks guys.
i think the point is to find out some new balances, or at least interesting and different enough twists on the old. they should look bad to the typical eye, at first. but after a season of playing, maybe, just maybe, some will turn out right.
so i don't agree with the first two picks for MOTS. the first was really replacable by extant popular maps (satter). the second looks a lot less conventional and well-made than it really is; it's a deception. so i've tried to dig up some other options to consider. i'm glad you appreciated it, but this is the first step and it will die if no one else is interested...
i'm not sure you are right about CoA. other races can get 2nd base pretty quickly as well. as we saw on paradoxxx, this is actually not good for zerg at all. IF it is too pro-zerg, it's because there's only 12 minerals. the more minerals in the mains on CoA, the less Zerg it will be. 2 gasses don't really mess up ZvT, and actually help P more than Z in ZvP. the issue is whether zerg are screwed or not--can zerg get a midgame going with more than 2 geyser, etc.?; tweaking the amount of mineral patchs should set the rest for zerg right
also remember zerg will either need to hatch their choke (3 hatch) or use significant units. they can't just sit back and drone whore like they would with a typical FE/sunken ZvT.
many of the maps i considered could be much better with minor development. i hope PGT's MOTS program inspires people to get their canidates ready... interesting, truly new maps, that are probably playable and definitely new. that's the only kind of new map broodwar has room for...
otherwise we should just sit back and pick extant pro maps...
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I updated Sacred Grounds. The picture in the first post should be updated (if not, refresh the image.) The nats and expos are tighter now.
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ok howabout this, no maps made by white dudes, they are all the same, either suck or pwn for zerg.
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people say the same thing about almost all korean maps...
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so now that pat is looking, and he's going to get good players to judge (like eri!)...
nominations?
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what's the center creep mean of home of the swarm?
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zerg can build buildings there, others have to kill the neutral creep things first. it's a way to give zerg advantages (in theory) to offset other features that are less friendly to zerg, creating (hopefully) an interesting map.
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